WEBVTT 00:00:00.020 --> 00:00:26.240 There's a podcast that's sure all that rocks hard is gold. And they're climbing the stairway to 11. When they get there they know the record stores are all closed. But online they can get what they came for. 00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:38.760 And they're streaming the Stairway to 11. 00:00:40.320 --> 00:00:43.020 Welcome to Stairway to 11. My name is George. 00:00:44.280 --> 00:00:44.920 This is John. 00:00:45.750 --> 00:00:46.320 And I'm TR. 00:00:47.120 --> 00:00:50.780 Welcome back to episode four. We're still here. 00:00:51.820 --> 00:00:57.820 Before we get into things, I want to mention that we do have a Facebook page and an Instagram page that you can go follow us. 00:00:57.840 --> 00:01:27.760 And, you know, aside from the other things that you might find on a social media page, there's also, like, extras from the episode. Pictures of vinyl and interesting memorabilia and stuff. So go check us out there. Follow us, and you'll also know when episodes come out. Things like that. I also want to mention that John and I, our other podcast, Metal Heads Podcast, just released a new episode this week as well. So if you are into the heavier side of things, go check out Metal Heads Podcast. 00:01:27.860 --> 00:01:28.620 as well. 00:01:29.960 --> 00:01:30.340 All right. 00:01:30.540 --> 00:01:34.880 Today, we have three new albums for you to delve into. 00:01:36.200 --> 00:01:38.600 And we're going to start off with my pick. 00:01:39.500 --> 00:01:48.320 And so this time, I chose to torture John and TR with Concrete Blonde and their album, Bloodletting. 00:01:49.400 --> 00:01:53.780 Released May 15th, 1990, this was Concrete Blonde's third album. 00:01:54.500 --> 00:02:02.640 Hailing from Hollywood, California, the band mixed rock, alternative, punk, and goth into what I consider a fairly unique sound. 00:02:05.260 --> 00:02:22.060 Johnette Napolitano, her name is tough, Johnette Napolitano, aside from having a challenging name to pronounce, shows her vocal prowess on this album, going back and forth between rockers and ballads. 00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:52.760 I've been a huge fan of this album since it was released and this is my favorite of their eight albums and possibly on my list of all-time favorite albums period my next favorite album by then would probably be their first album the self-titled album which gives a really good taste of late 80s Hollywood with less hairspray they even do a great cover of George Harrison's Beware of Darkness but back to Bloodheading this album also contained the band's biggest chart hit which we will get into later 00:02:52.800 --> 00:03:22.720 The Album came at the end of a particularly bad period of time for her and the band. So due to that, the album is a bit darker and cathartic. There's a lot of melancholy on this album, so sorry, TR. Alas, I don't think the band ever received the massive credit they should have received for their catalog. And as far as I know, the band has been on a hiatus for a while now, the last decade at least. I was lucky enough to catch them on the tour for Mexican Moon a few years later. I saw them at the Michigan Theater in Ann Arbor. 00:03:22.800 --> 00:03:52.760 Michigan. It was a killer set. And that was when I learned that James Mankey played guitar without a pick, which I found very interesting, given the style of music. Anywho, do you guys have any comments before we get into the tracks? So this, my only comment on this, like just overarching is I found it interesting that, you know, in episode three, we covered Judas Priest's Sad Wings of Destiny. Sad Wings. Yeah. Sorry. There's kind of space there. Yeah. And the producer and 00:03:52.820 --> 00:04:20.519 The Recording Engineer on that album was Chris Sangarides. And he was also the producer and recording engineer on this album. I did notice that. Which I think was an interesting tie between the two episodes. That was totally why I did it. Totally. I'm sure. Awesome. All right, then let's go ahead and get into the album proper. First song on the album is the title track, Bloodletting, parentheses, The Vampire Song. 00:04:21.360 --> 00:04:50.640 I like every song on this album, but the title track is definitely like top three or four for me. I feel like it takes some inspiration from the Anne Rice vampire novels. I love the ominous groove of the song and the gang vocals of the chorus. Not only is it catchy, but it sounds like something people would be singing walking down the street during Mardi Gras before, you know, vampire feasting on hapless tours. Kind of a unique song on the album and a total classic. Her vocals are amazing. 00:04:52.479 --> 00:05:19.320 So did you like steal my notes from this? Because you basically said almost everything that I wrote down. Actually, I had Jay do it for me. You did it again. I was, I had the same feel that it has that kind of, I don't want to say it's like a jangle, but it has that kind of twang to the sound that makes me feel like I would be walking in New Orleans at night. It just has that vibe. 00:05:19.700 --> 00:05:34.700 It's like, you know, there's probably a style, like a name for it, like, you know, oh, it's a blah, blah, in blah, blah time, or a waltz, or, you know, there's probably a name for that type of feel, and I just don't know what it is. 00:05:35.040 --> 00:05:49.080 Yeah, it just gave me, the words that I came up with, obviously, you mentioned gothic, but it had just a little bit of a rockabilly vibe to it, but a modern take on it, not like the stray cats who were trying to almost, 00:05:49.960 --> 00:05:51.520 the bands from the 50s. 00:05:51.800 --> 00:05:51.920 Yeah. 00:05:52.640 --> 00:05:53.960 But with a little more oomph. 00:05:54.180 --> 00:05:56.940 This had more of a 90s alternative vibe to it. 00:05:57.340 --> 00:06:04.560 So, yeah, her vocals are amazing on the whole album because she's got such a deep and like you said, sultry voice. 00:06:04.980 --> 00:06:08.080 It's not operatic, which makes me like it a lot. 00:06:09.140 --> 00:06:10.100 It was a cool opening track. 00:06:10.140 --> 00:06:10.580 I liked it. 00:06:11.120 --> 00:06:11.420 Awesome. 00:06:12.999 --> 00:06:15.500 So I wrote that it was quirky. 00:06:16.920 --> 00:06:18.480 Definitely got a vampire vibe. 00:06:19.380 --> 00:06:48.380 I didn't like the gang vocals that much, but I get like how they fit the song. You suppose. But this, I'll say this, I liked other tracks on this album a lot better. All right. Fine now. I see how it is. All right. So track two is called The Sky is a Poisonous Garden. This song kicks things into a higher gear. One of the heavier songs on the album. 00:06:48.680 --> 00:07:18.600 It has a sort of frantic, chaotic, and dangerous feel to it. I've always kind of wondered what the title means. I'm not really sure, but it's a pretty cool song, whatever she was thinking of. Yeah, that's about all I have to say about that. That's it? Wow. Keep in mind, I had COVID all weekend. I know, I'm joking. I don't have as many notes as I might. We're going to pick you up, George. Fine. Thank you. So the people who haven't listened to the album that much before, or at all, are the ones that are going to have to talk about it the most. 00:07:18.660 --> 00:07:48.640 is what you're saying. Yes. That's right. This is, yeah, I agree. An uptempo song. It's got a little bit of a touch of post-punk, I think, to it and an alternative vibe. And it seems to me that this would be a really cool song to see live. That you would really get into this. You could almost master this, you know. It has just a certain kind of tempo to it that, yeah, you want to let loose a little bit. And I wouldn't say the guitar 00:07:48.660 --> 00:08:18.500 was bluesy, but he taps into that sound a little bit. He's, none of his guitar solos on paper seem to match the music, the way he plays, which is, I think, really unique about his playing, because there's a few songs later that we'll get to that. I always, it almost felt like if it was anybody else trying to play it, other than the person writing the music, it just wouldn't, he wouldn't be able to pull it off. And I think the fact that you mentioned that he doesn't pick, he uses his fingers, he gets some really, 00:08:18.660 --> 00:08:48.500 cool kind of harsh sounds that seem to match the songs that he's playing. And so, and I'm not a guitar player, but I noticed right off the bat, every solo just, especially for this time period, early nineties, alternative rock was all about no guitar solos at all. Minus like Jerry Cantrell. And it's quite cool to hear him playing things and not just playing your standard guitar solos. He's, I wouldn't say he's experimenting, but he's doing some kind of different. 00:08:48.680 --> 00:09:18.600 things. Not unusual. He's not the first person to do it. But he's just doing some things that kind of make him stand out his playing style with the type of music that they're playing. Keep in mind, this came out in 90. It's their third album. So they, you know, they started in the 80s when solos were a thing. So. Yeah, of course. Yeah. And no, it's a good second song follow up. And it does change the pace right away from the first. 00:09:19.520 --> 00:09:46.540 Yeah, and definitely more night imagery in the lyrics and even in the vibe of the song, references to the Raven. My only thing is, I just, and I think it's, obviously it's that alternative style sound. To me, there just wasn't enough bottom end to the guitar. It was just, there was no, like the tone, I was looking for more like a thicker tone. 00:09:47.140 --> 00:09:51.780 But I get like that's not what this kind of music is about like that 00:09:51.980 --> 00:10:02.060 the tone is like what it is because that's the type of music it is so so that left me wanting a little but but overall you know cool vibe 00:10:03.240 --> 00:10:12.339 the curse of the guitarist every guitar player I know yeah every single one I don't want all you out I don't 00:10:13.000 --> 00:10:42.260 Yeah, but you play drums too, George. So it's my, our friend Joe is the same exact way. He will not like anything if he does not like the sound and tone of the guitar. It could be the greatest song ever in that shit. I know Joe and I love Joe because of that. It's the same all the time. It's true. I can't help it. No, it's not. I'm not saying, 00:10:42.340 --> 00:11:12.300 I'm saying it's literally almost every guitarist I know. But you know what? You're true to form. Yeah, you're not wrong. It's true. Like I, I have in my mind a certain feeling of what the tone should be or what I feel is like an ideal guitar tone. And the things that aren't that, you know, end up just somehow, you know, taking a lower level to me. But let me break it down for everyone out there. 00:11:12.360 --> 00:11:42.300 who's not a guitar player. These people that we're talking about, these guitarists, quote unquote, are looking for the brown sound. I want the brown sound in everything. If you don't know what the brown sound is, go look up Eddie Van Halen. It's there. This is the El Dorado of guitar tones. It is. And no one, people can get close to mimicking it, but no one can actually recreate it. 00:11:42.900 --> 00:12:11.020 It's the funniest thing in the world. I know one guitarist who hasn't said much about it, and I'm not dropping names, but TR and I know a guitarist who plays in a band from Europe, and he loves a lot of music, and I've never heard him ever say anything like this, and he's a very good guitarist. Don't want to derail us any more than this, so I'll just stop right there. All right. That's all the comments I have. So track three is Caroline. 00:12:12.360 --> 00:12:41.160 And this takes the intensity level back down again. And we end up in pseudo ballady territory. It combines melody and melancholy to create a pretty catchy song. I felt like this one had more of a post-punk feel than some of the other tracks. You know, it's very chill. It's melodic. You know, it's not. I like all the songs on the album, but it's not the song that I would be like, oh, yeah, when you're Caroline, when I hear it, I'm like, oh, yeah, good tune. 00:12:42.680 --> 00:13:10.400 This is funny because this is where I started to like the album. I knew you were going to say that. No, it's true. Like when I listened to this, it was like, oh, this is this song seems much more suited to her vocals. I like the groove of it. The guitar tones were better on this song. I like the solo on this song. I like the whole mood of it. I just felt like, oh, this like when I heard this song, I felt like, OK, this is what they really should sound like. 00:13:10.460 --> 00:13:38.640 You know, the other two songs seemed like they were, I don't know, a little out of place or something. When I heard this, I felt like, okay, this is really, this to me is how they are supposed to sound, even though I didn't know anything about this band. Honestly, you're right. I mean, of the first three songs, this is probably more representative of them overall than the first two songs. Oh, okay. 00:13:41.620 --> 00:13:42.060 Okay. 00:13:44.060 --> 00:13:47.280 Sky's Poisonous Garden is heavier than most of their stuff. 00:13:49.020 --> 00:13:50.080 So you're not wrong. 00:13:50.580 --> 00:13:56.760 And the funny thing is normally I would probably prefer like rocking and heavy and that. 00:13:56.810 --> 00:13:58.640 But like, I don't know. 00:13:58.650 --> 00:14:03.000 Her voice was so beautiful on this song that I just felt like, I don't know. 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:07.440 I just felt like this was, you know, a much better manifestation of the whole band. 00:14:07.660 --> 00:14:07.860 All right. 00:14:08.500 --> 00:14:37.240 I'll take it. Yeah, so I like this song, but to me, this is the most dated song on the album. This sounds like the early 90s, meaning if you didn't tell me who this was and you just threw it on, I would immediately think back to that period. And so that's not a knock on it. It just, hell, if I hear a Yes song with a lot of keyboards and a lot of John Anderson meandering off into the world of John Anderson, 00:14:37.820 --> 00:15:05.340 I'm going to say that's got to be the 70s. It dates it. Most music is dated in some fashion. It's a product of its time. Yes, and that's to take it a little further. To me, this is definitely a product of that period because there's still songs from bands that you hear today. I could hear a Motorhead song today and still think, man, that would still kick ass today. It would still sound like it came out today. It just depends on what it is and the style. 00:15:07.320 --> 00:15:37.280 have said it's three songs in a row and all three have different styles right off the bat and so i think that kind of gives the idea that this album is not going to be the same song over and over again which i don't necessarily mind that because sometimes if you do it in the right way you can venture off a little bit and still the bottom line is still you still the band so yeah it was good i liked it it's the first of the three name songs 00:15:37.320 --> 00:16:07.240 on the album. We'll get to a few more. Yeah. All right. Next we have track four, Darkening of the Light. This is another one of my favorite tunes off the album. It has a mid-paced, stilted carnival vibe. And it's chock full of hooks that get this song stuck in my head every time I hear it. And not just the lyrics, but some of the musical passages as well get stuck in my head. It's very melodic and catchy, but dark and ominous. 00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:14.300 but pretty too, you know? So, I don't know. I'm curious what T.R. thought of this one. 00:16:15.060 --> 00:16:37.260 So, I really liked where this was going because, again, it's another slower song. You're hearing her vocals more. Like, you know, you can really hear her voice come through on this. And I really like these slower songs. I feel like it just, it complements the band. 00:16:37.280 --> 00:17:04.900 these songs really sounded much better to me than the first two. And I felt like, I agree, George, this was kind of like there was a mystery to this song. And I felt like it was a Dio song. Yeah, I could totally hear that. Not so much the call and response. Shine on, friend. Yeah, exactly, right. That kind of chord progression of the melody sounded like something Dio would do. 00:17:04.920 --> 00:17:34.820 And even some of the lyrics are Dio-esque in terms of the mystery and it's unknown. I don't know. It just sounds like... Obviously, it's not like a Dio song, but to me, it felt like one. And there was a feeling like, yeah, I could see Dio doing something like this in the way it's delivered and the style of it. So yeah, I like this tune. I felt it was a nice follow-up to Caroline. 00:17:34.920 --> 00:18:03.760 because I felt like, okay, now I'm liking this. This is what I feel like this band should be about. I won't disagree with that. One of my faves. John? I'm definitely hearing this song different than you guys. There's no doubt about that. I did not get any Dio vibe whatsoever. I actually didn't like the dueling vocals at the beginning. It's not dueling, it's like echoed. Yeah, but it comes off like it's dueling now. 00:18:04.680 --> 00:18:33.920 And I wasn't so big on that myself. Now, that doesn't mean I didn't like the song. I just didn't particularly care for that vocal effect that she used. And I actually, and I'm not saying there's anything folky about the song, but his guitar playing, again, just made me think of some folky stuff a little bit. A little jangly. Yeah, just a little, you know, and again, that's his style. And that's, I like that about the way he plays on this. Now, this is coming from a non-guitar, so apparently I won't know anything I'm talking about, but that's just how I hear it. 00:18:34.460 --> 00:19:04.400 So I'm poking fun of myself. I'm not saying anything about anybody. I'm making fun of myself. It's a decent song overall. I thought the chorus was cool, but I didn't. I feel like there's other songs on the album that are much darker than this one. Just my take. So to be sure. So, yeah. So I think you just tapped into something there. The folky kind of thing, right? Because in some ways I felt like there was a Richie Blackmore thing to this. That's why I think the DOP. 00:19:04.460 --> 00:19:11.040 I was thinking like from that like a rainbow angle not like necessarily like a Dio solo thing but 00:19:11.960 --> 00:19:17.500 obviously like okay like the first rainbow album yeah exactly yeah there's like a kind of 00:19:17.760 --> 00:19:23.780 renaissance fairish yeah exactly and that was where I was coming from with that so okay so I'm glad you 00:19:24.010 --> 00:19:29.579 you know clarified that for me because like I couldn't put my finger on it but that was that's what it really is I think 00:19:29.580 --> 00:19:59.020 But the song's not folky. It's just his playing. He does a few things that makes you think of that. And George, you hit it on the head, the word jangle too. He jangles a little bit when he plays, which is that kind of homeland, not homeland, what's it called? Heartland type music. You know, like the Tom Petty type thing. The birds, you know, that jangle sound. And he just taps a little bit and gives it that folky kind of vibe, which I like that part of it a lot, actually. I dug that I picked up on that. 00:19:59.060 --> 00:20:27.600 But again, we all hear things differently too. So I mean, play this for somebody on the other podcasts and they might hear something else. Yeah. All right. So track five is called I Don't Need a Hero. It's a slower song with a lot of attitude. A breakup song where she asserts her independence and declares that unlike Bonnie Tyler, she doesn't need a hero to rescue her. Not surprisingly, it's also pretty catchy. At least I thought it was. 00:20:28.420 --> 00:20:57.660 It's slower, which I know maybe that puts it in TR land, but it's got a little bit of a snarl, so maybe it doesn't. But I dig it. It's somewhere around the middle for me, I would say. Yeah, this one, this is my favorite song on the album. Yeah, middle or favorite, you know, one of those. Because it's so dark, and she is angry without, it's controlled anger, though, almost like she's past her issue, and now she's taking assertion. She's taking herself first, yes. 00:20:57.900 --> 00:21:27.760 And I kind of dug that. I dig the kind of dark haunting vibe, especially with the drums. There's not much to them. They're just, they're placed in a certain way. Everything's subtle and unassuming when you listen, but there's little slight changes, which by the way, is going to be a hint for this whole podcast for me. Subtle and unassuming. Everything is sparse. You know, when I hear the guitarist work on this, it makes me, I now know who I was thinking of when I, and I just, it dawned on me, 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:57.820 as we started. I'm thinking of Chris Isaac a little bit, the way he played. He's from around that period. That same kind of sparse, deserty, twangy sound a little bit. He does that a little in this song, but I do love the darkness and the hauntingness. I like the pacing of the album up to this point. I know some people may not like all the differences between all five songs, while it's still the same band, are all slightly different directional songs. 00:21:57.900 --> 00:22:27.800 Yeah, even tonally, too. Yes. And his playing, his solos, everything they're doing. One last thing I will say also about her vocals, which I think she's great, to be honest with you. But she does remind me of Linda Perry a little bit from Four Non Blondes with that kind of deeper, sultry voice. Oh, you ruined it. I hate Four Non Blondes. Granted, I only know the one song. I'm not a fan either. I'm just saying her vocal style and sound reminds me of her. Yeah, it completely. 00:22:27.900 --> 00:22:28.460 makes sense. 00:22:29.080 --> 00:22:29.160 Yeah. 00:22:29.620 --> 00:22:30.000 Oh, no. 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:32.080 I like, I like concrete blonde more. 00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:32.540 Oh yeah. 00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:36.460 Even though I think my cousin may have jammed with foreign on blondes at one point, 00:22:36.890 --> 00:22:38.700 I could be wrong about that, but I thought she did. 00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:41.000 Anyway, I won't take any more time. 00:22:41.490 --> 00:22:45.300 Like I said, by far, this was my favorite on the album because it is so dark and haunting. 00:22:46.500 --> 00:22:46.680 Okay. 00:22:48.000 --> 00:22:54.220 So yeah, I, you know, this was a chilled out tune and it continues in that vein of the two before it. 00:22:54.800 --> 00:23:24.760 I like the chimey guitar solo on this song. Some of the guitar tones on this kind of reminded me of the Colts Love Album when they were still goth. You know, yeah, they were still semi goth and they really didn't have the thick tones that came when Rick Rubin produced Electric for them. But yeah, I mean, obviously a lost relationship. I get the attitude. I didn't. I kind of really I kind of 00:23:24.780 --> 00:23:54.760 I don't like when she goes into the like almost like this spoken word kind of thing you know I feel like it's you know I want to hear her sing because she's got a beautiful voice you know and I get like what she's conveying and you're going to use your voice in the way that you feel like okay I want to convey this emotion or this you know it's not always going to be beautiful right so I get that I just I prefer when she's singing and you know 00:23:55.220 --> 00:24:24.680 vocalizing in a way that's more melodic. If it was a metal album, that would have been the growly part. So yeah, you know how I feel about that. Yeah. I think that's why I like this song so much is because she's not singing per se, because she's not dominating the song with her vocals, because there's really not much to the song. Everyone plays a small part of it. It's in the pocket. And everyone's small part makes the whole thing, but everyone's bit itself. 00:24:24.760 --> 00:24:27.700 It's not like we're listening to rock and roll from Led Zeppelin where 00:24:28.020 --> 00:24:32.500 if we took everybody out and just listen to the drum track, your head would just be like 00:24:33.040 --> 00:24:54.160 thumping, you know, or the guitar would just be big. Everyone's parts really small in this and it all fits perfectly. And so I get what you're saying, TR, but I feel like if she was singing, she might be over singing that even without trying because there's not much to the song. Right. You wouldn't get this. It wouldn't convey the same thing. Right. So and it's so she's using it. You know, she's painting with a different brush here. 00:24:54.260 --> 00:25:24.220 And I get that. And that's what's required for the song to convey what she wants. I guess I just I prefer when she's singing like Caroline or, you know, Darkening of the Light where, you know, it's like this melodic thing and her voice is really beautiful. But yeah, maybe she's maybe this is in character. She's like we were saying, she's past whatever issue she's dealing with now. And now she's calm. Yeah. She was singing. Maybe it would be that she was being franticized. 00:25:24.280 --> 00:25:54.200 Take care for an ass, something like that. Yeah. Yes. Whatever. It's cool. As we'll come to see, she's not over it yet. Yeah. But stay on target. It's cool. They put this in the middle of the album because it's a nice piece to have to now do something different on the album. You know, so. Yeah. So track six, Days and Days. I always think that I don't like this song and then I hear it and I go, oh yeah, I do. And we start getting heavier again. 00:25:54.240 --> 00:25:54.780 with this one. 00:25:55.900 --> 00:25:58.540 And it starts with a nice groove and builds up to the chorus. 00:25:59.360 --> 00:26:03.500 And I love the vocal phrasing on the verse, which TR is probably going to say, 00:26:03.620 --> 00:26:04.940 it's just like the last one, only faster. 00:26:06.080 --> 00:26:07.200 Because she's just, she's almost rapping. 00:26:08.080 --> 00:26:09.260 She's like talking really fast. 00:26:09.560 --> 00:26:10.340 But I don't know. 00:26:10.420 --> 00:26:11.820 It just, it gives it an intensity. 00:26:12.220 --> 00:26:16.960 It's intense and it blends so well with the music before kicking back into the wild abandon of the chorus. 00:26:17.280 --> 00:26:18.720 Days and days, you know, it's a banger. 00:26:19.900 --> 00:26:20.800 Yeah, I guess I would agree. 00:26:20.860 --> 00:26:50.720 Although, again, you know, it's a lot of spoken word. And like I say, it seems like a waste of her voice, you know, like there's a lot of words to fit in there. It's true. And I almost felt like it was like a talking head song or something. It was like quirky like that, where it's like, you know, where she's rattling off all these words. And I get, you know, that's what the song is. But again, I just I felt like, okay, yeah, she's talking through this. And I, I don't know, I, 00:26:50.860 --> 00:27:20.780 I guess there's really no way to make it more melodic. But yeah, I just, I don't know, this one didn't do a lot for me. I felt like, oh man, this seems like a waste of her voice. I'm sure that's just, I gotta get over like the beauty of her voice and just like, you know, accept that, you know, she's gonna use it to convey what she wants to in the song rather than showcase the beauty of her voice. Maybe you should try the next album, Walking Down London. Okay, maybe. All right. 00:27:20.880 --> 00:27:50.800 John? Yeah, so this one reminds me actually a little bit of this guy's Poisonous Garden. It has a similar up-tempo, and I thought it was a decent song. Again, it's the reason why I think of it as the second song on the album is because it seems like it'd be a good song to see live because of the tempo on the song. I must not get it the same way because I don't get as much spoken word on this one, but it might be how we want her to sing. So I agree with you. 00:27:50.880 --> 00:28:20.740 TR on that point. So it's a good song. It's a nice change of pace from the last song, which had a very slow, dark vibe. So speaking of dark, we're going to go to track number seven, The Beast. Hands down, my favorite song on the album, which probably means it's TR's least favorite song on the album. We'll find out in a minute. But it's also probably the heaviest and darkest song, I think. This song is a metaphor likening love to a monster. 00:28:20.860 --> 00:28:50.840 in the dark looking to consume its next victim. This is one of those songs you go to after a breakup. When I said she clearly isn't over it yet, this is what I meant. It's chicken soup for the broken heart. It's a banger to boot. But check out the lyrics for this one. It's clever. And it also briefly returns to the vampire theme. And I just absolutely love this song. I cannot overstate that. So tear it up. Here's no, dude, this is a 00:28:50.860 --> 00:29:20.820 This was the most fun song for me on this album because this was the most Judas Priest-like song on the album. Honestly, I'd like to hear Priest make this even more sinister because the beat and the lyrics are very Priest-like. It's like a metal song, man. It is. If it was a little harder and the guitar tone was a little more medley, this would be like a Priest-like. 00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:50.720 If you listen to these lyrics, it's just like, and the way she delivers it, it's like, yeah. And, and, you know, the guitar tone is there, like it, it pays off. And so anyway, this was like the most, I don't know, this was the most like, to me was like the most metal song on the album, if you will. Yeah. And I just like felt like, yeah, you know, it felt like a priest tune to me, which I, 00:29:50.860 --> 00:30:20.820 I know is probably ridiculous, but that's kind of what I heard when I listened to this song. But these lyrics are like crazy, you know? Yeah, but it's no different than any kind of priest song where like, you know, he's like, I could hear Halford just completely embodying like what she's saying and she delivers it very well. Like her delivery on this is really good. I think Halford would even take it another step further. Yeah, I could totally hear him doing this. Yeah, exactly. 00:30:20.900 --> 00:30:22.960 I have to quote some of the lyrics because I just have to. 00:30:23.660 --> 00:30:23.760 Yeah. 00:30:24.160 --> 00:30:25.640 Love is a poet. 00:30:25.940 --> 00:30:26.960 Love sings the songs. 00:30:27.500 --> 00:30:29.360 Pointing his finger, you follow along. 00:30:30.260 --> 00:30:31.220 Voices are calling. 00:30:31.600 --> 00:30:33.120 The monster wants out of you. 00:30:33.580 --> 00:30:34.780 Paws you and claws you. 00:30:34.840 --> 00:30:36.100 You try not to fall. 00:30:37.060 --> 00:30:39.140 Love is the leech sucking you up. 00:30:39.560 --> 00:30:41.720 Love is a vampire drunk on your blood. 00:30:42.780 --> 00:30:44.860 Love is the beast that will tear out your heart, 00:30:45.520 --> 00:30:47.460 hungrily lick it, and painfully pick it apart. 00:30:48.580 --> 00:31:18.500 How many songs on Turbo would you replace with that song? True. But yeah, I could totally hear Halford singing that. Yeah. All right. John doesn't seem amused. No, you just mentioned Turbo and that album sucks. I know. That's why this would be better than that. Everything's better than Turbo and Ram It Down. There's like three good songs on those two albums. I know. I was going to say, don't you knock on Blood Red Skies. That song's cool. Okay, yes. 00:31:18.600 --> 00:31:48.400 Sram It Down, Out in the Cold is cool. Turtle Lovers is a cool tune. It's just I'm tired of it. Locked In's okay. You know, I don't need to talk about my private property or anything. We don't need no, no, no, no parental guidance here. We're all going to rock around the world. So now I was listening to the same song again. And I don't know, maybe with two songs, you know, because the previous song also reminded me of a song. 00:31:48.580 --> 00:32:18.540 a previous song on the album. So I don't know, for some reason, I didn't get as much out of it as you guys. And that's not to say that it's not a good song. It is. I didn't dislike one song on this album. And what I like about the album is that the first time I listened to it, I didn't dislike any. I liked most of it. Second time, the song sounded like, oh, I remember this. And then the third time, I was like, I know all these songs. So then you have to test with the album. It's really easy to pick up on. 00:32:18.600 --> 00:32:47.140 this and to digest it. So it might've just been the one time I'm not, I'm not in synchronicity with myself as I'm listening. You know, it's real easy to get distracted on something or to like something so much prior to it that after you're like, Oh, wow, it's not holding up for me again. I liked the song. It just didn't catch me as much as you guys. All right. Fair. So track eight is Lullaby. 00:32:48.080 --> 00:33:17.960 After the intensity and drama of the beast, a lullaby brings things back down to a slower Caroline level of chill. So I'm going to guess that TR liked this one. Where the beast was scary and dangerous, uh-oh, a lullaby brings back a warm sense of comfort. A warm snuggie, one might say. A lyrical snuggie. I like it. It's a cute song, you know. It's all right. I like it, but not one of my faves. TR stole my notes via J for this one. 00:33:18.760 --> 00:33:47.260 because, and I'm glad you mentioned it earlier, TR, I got a cult vibe from the Love Album on this song a little bit, too. Yeah, and it's funny that you mentioned that a couple songs prior to that. Just a little bit, just a little touch of that. I'm with you, George. I mean, it's a decent song. To me, I just was like, this is a straight-up ballad for them. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with it. Nothing, no. I wouldn't call it filler, it's just... Not at all, you know. No, I would. 00:33:47.880 --> 00:34:16.820 I cannot read you at all today. Yeah. So it reminded me just one last thing of I don't need a hero in a sense. It's structurally written like it. There's not much to the song. It's not over complicated. It's it does it. You do drop pretty far in terms of the intensity level from the beast. So I thought it was right. Yeah. All right. What's the problem here? Yeah. This song just does not pay off. I don't know. The verses were boring. It's OK. It had a very. 00:34:17.320 --> 00:34:46.600 So, John, you talked about earlier in the album, like, when you hear the song, you know, oh, yeah, this is from late 80s, early 90s. Like, just this song to me was that on this album. Like, it was the most, like, of its time to me out of all the songs on this album. It reminded me, like, and I know this isn't, it's just, you're going to laugh because, like, it has nothing to do with this. 00:34:47.300 --> 00:35:16.900 But like it made me think of like all these early 90s bands like School of Fish and like all these other bands that had like these one hit wonders. And they all sounded like this song. And I don't know. I just I found it like I found this song just boring and it doesn't pay off for me. Like I just I don't know. Well, I did like the solo section, though. I will say that. No Snuggie for you. I'm sorry, George. It's all right. I'm not offended by this one. Okay. So track nine. 00:35:17.080 --> 00:35:18.000 is Joey. 00:35:19.200 --> 00:35:21.120 And John mentioned Motorhead earlier. 00:35:21.560 --> 00:35:23.180 This is their ace of spades. 00:35:24.160 --> 00:35:27.300 If you know Concrete Blonde, then you most likely know this song. 00:35:28.240 --> 00:35:32.740 I'm not sure if Joey is the guy that wreaked so much havoc on the rest of the lyrics of the album. 00:35:32.880 --> 00:35:34.040 I suspect he is. 00:35:34.880 --> 00:35:39.200 But if so, it seems like things are starting to turn around for the star-crossed lovers. 00:35:40.460 --> 00:35:41.880 When I saw them on the tour, 00:35:42.060 --> 00:36:12.040 Johnette said the question she gets asked a lot is whether she and Joey are still together and I can't speak to whether they are now 20 30 odd years later but at the time she said she wanted to let everyone know they were doing well that was nice I hope that's still the case anyway despite being the radio hit I still think it's a great song so I actually knew this song see told you yeah so the ace of spades so when I heard it 00:36:12.080 --> 00:36:41.520 I was like, so this is Concrete Blonde. And I, what I was saying to Jen about this album, when she was asking what we were listening to, I said, yeah, I knew the name. I just couldn't put the songs with the names, which is pretty much everything from 87 to like Ford till now, when it comes to regular FM radio music, I can't put the name with the song or with the band. And so when I heard this right away, I was like, okay, now I know. 00:36:42.080 --> 00:37:10.980 I need to know. Yeah. It's a huge reading hit because it was on all the time. Yeah. Heard it constantly. And it does still sound like this period, but that's okay because it's such a well-written song. It's got some interesting things in it. Her vocals are great on this song and she expands them enough that you get her full range from top to bottom. And it's hard to argue a song when it's written like this. It does stand out from the rest of the album though. 00:37:11.720 --> 00:37:12.620 a little bit. 00:37:13.000 --> 00:37:22.000 And I don't know if that's a curse or not, but you can always tell a hit song from a band versus an album that has a lot of hit songs. 00:37:22.140 --> 00:37:28.160 You can always tell there's just one hit song on an album because you hear that hit song and it doesn't necessarily sound like all the other songs on the album. 00:37:28.400 --> 00:37:31.200 It's like a producer came in and helped write it or something. 00:37:32.080 --> 00:37:32.160 Yeah. 00:37:32.360 --> 00:37:35.460 And I'm not saying that's this case, but you can always tell that. 00:37:35.500 --> 00:38:04.880 And I got that a little bit on this album. With this song. Because it is such a. And I'm quoting quotes. When I say polished. It doesn't sound polished. But it's such a polished song in terms of. How complete it is. And how well written it is. So. But it's a good song. Everyone probably knows this song. And even if you're like me. And didn't know the title of the band name. You'd probably heard it a thousand times. Jay mentioned it on the podcast. Metalhead podcast Saturday. 00:38:05.500 --> 00:38:34.940 He's like, oh, Joe, yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's a testament that people can still remember this song, even if you don't listen to this type of music. Yeah, so I obviously really, I like this song. It was very catchy. Did you know it? It was vaguely familiar, but I think like, I felt like, yeah, I think I remember this song, but it wasn't like, oh, yeah, I totally know this song. It was just, oh, yeah, I think I remember this. So it didn't really, you know, 00:38:35.500 --> 00:39:04.720 It completely knocked me over in terms of, oh yeah, I remember this, and oh yeah, I remember this is Concrete Plante. It was more just, wow, this is definitely like John. Okay, yeah, this is the hit on the album. I can see how this was the hit. And definitely, so she's emoting like crazy on this album, on this particular track. And you can feel it, and you can, it just, 00:39:04.800 --> 00:39:34.780 It takes on a whole other level of emotion and vocalizing that she's doing on this song. Yeah, she alludes to it in other places on this album, but this is the most emotive that you hear her get. To me, it reminded me of similar era heart songs. I was listening to the album on 00:39:35.619 --> 00:40:04.760 And alongside of the stuff, they post reviews. And a review said, this is a lesser known heart song. Yeah. It reminded me of like, all I want to do is make love to you by heart, right? Like it had that same kind of vibe in a couple of places, not like the whole song, but just like there are a couple of places. It reminded me of that kind of that, that era of heart and that, that tone. But yeah, 00:40:04.800 --> 00:40:34.720 You know, forget about that. It's a great song. It's definitely well-written. You can tell it comes from a place of serious emotion. And yeah, just a really good song. And I can see how that was the hit. I totally get it. Yeah, I like how in the verses and stuff, she's like speaking intimately, quietly and melodic. But then, you know, towards the end, she's like belting out, you know, Joey, I'm not angry anymore. 00:40:35.680 --> 00:40:36.980 It's just like power 00:40:37.820 --> 00:40:37.900 Yeah 00:40:38.620 --> 00:40:39.760 So yeah, killer 00:40:40.020 --> 00:40:41.920 Hey, I got one last thing to say about it 00:40:42.200 --> 00:40:43.960 This song, this album 00:40:44.540 --> 00:40:46.000 Now I figured out what it reminds me of 00:40:46.680 --> 00:40:48.360 Not to the extent of the difference 00:40:48.760 --> 00:40:49.980 But of the hit song 00:40:51.180 --> 00:40:51.980 Genesis album 00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:52.920 And then there were three 00:40:53.960 --> 00:40:54.940 Which is for the most part 00:40:55.120 --> 00:40:55.180 What? 00:40:56.140 --> 00:40:57.200 If you let me finish 00:40:57.440 --> 00:40:57.720 Alright 00:40:58.040 --> 00:40:59.260 I said not to this extent 00:40:59.560 --> 00:41:01.220 But it reminds you of this album 00:41:01.360 --> 00:41:04.780 Because you have a full album of prog rock songs 00:41:04.780 --> 00:41:34.400 And then you have follow, you follow me. That's the point I'm making about the, you know, the hit song when it stands out from the rest of the album. Oh, yeah. You just waited a second. I know. I should have waited for it. Wait your turn. That was my wait. If people are wondering what I mean by that, I'm not knocking it. It's just, it does stand out from the rest of the album. Clearly stands out from the rest of the album. And, but that's not a knock on the rest of the album in this case. No, this isn't like Katrina and the waves. 00:41:34.800 --> 00:42:04.680 Remember their big hit single? Yeah, yeah, exactly. What is it, the Sunshine song? Walking on sunshine. It's the first song on the album. Yeah. It's like, that's the other thing, too, about this is at the back end of the album. And this is their big song. That says a lot about it. It's like, wait for it. To record executives and PR and marketing, they're mad about that. No, this has got to be a front. This is the first thing. Yeah, right, exactly. To fans of music, this is a badass. 00:42:05.700 --> 00:42:33.160 But it makes sense chronologically with the songs. Of course. Of course. But that's what makes this even better is that it's at the back end. You very rarely see hit songs at the back end of an album. It's not the way they're tracked. It just isn't. And that says a lot that they were able to stick to that storyline and still put it at the end without the record label saying, oh, no, let's rearrange this. 00:42:34.040 --> 00:43:03.940 Which is nice. That's what I actually, I end up liking the song more because of that. Anyway. I want to go on. You know, I love that you tied Concrete Blonde and Genesis together. And not only like one of the more obscure Genesis albums. I love it. I'll find another album that's worth it. Dude, this is why you're my friend. And for the record, it doesn't sound anything like And Then There Were Three by Genesis. Thank you. First of all. But there are only three people in the band. 00:43:04.040 --> 00:43:04.780 Yes. 00:43:05.160 --> 00:43:06.080 Oh, yeah. 00:43:06.200 --> 00:43:09.940 He's going to get this and he'll probably lose it when he hears this, 00:43:10.790 --> 00:43:14.080 but there's actually guitar on the concrete blonde album. 00:43:15.340 --> 00:43:18.320 And if you're a Genesis fan, you know exactly what that is. 00:43:18.320 --> 00:43:18.460 Yeah. 00:43:18.510 --> 00:43:21.080 And I think I can hear a bass on this album too. 00:43:21.720 --> 00:43:21.820 Yeah. 00:43:24.220 --> 00:43:26.540 So real quick, when Steve Hackett left Genesis, 00:43:26.910 --> 00:43:30.740 because he was mad that he wasn't getting his just due and he wanted to do his own thing. 00:43:31.300 --> 00:44:00.940 Michael Rutherford, the bass player, who's also Mike from Mike and the Mechanics that you heard in the 80s, he played guitar. And while he's an adequate guitar player, he shouldn't be a lead guitar player. And had they just hired Daryl Strummer back then to be their full-time guitarist, they make him a band member, all this would have been solved. Let's move on to the final song. All right. And that final song, track 10, is called Tomorrow Wendy. 00:44:02.180 --> 00:44:30.280 And this is, I would say, my second favorite song on the album. It's an amazing track to end the album on. It's extremely sad, heartbreakingly beautiful. If you know what the song is about, get to that in a minute. It was originally written by Andy Preboy. I'm sorry if I say his name wrong. He's the lead singer of Wall of Voodoo. Oh, I didn't know that. And Jeanette actually sang on the original song. She did one of the verses and like some backup stuff. And then she ended up covering it for this album. 00:44:31.320 --> 00:45:01.280 And both versions are great. So the song, it's really like tragic and hopeless and makes me cry every time I hear it. So the background on this song is that Andy had a friend named Wendy grew up with her, whatever, you know, life goes the way it goes. She ended up a prostitute on drugs, you know, I think out in LA and she got AIDS in the 00:45:02.759 --> 00:45:30.460 And rather than die slowly from AIDS, she purposely OD'd on heroin. And when you know that and you listen to this song, it's just gut-wrenching. So, like I said, every time I hit this song, I just bawl because it's just so. And, you know, and then when she gets into the priest, you know, and, you know, I told the priest, don't count on any second coming. God got his ass kicked the first time he came down here slumming. 00:45:30.760 --> 00:46:00.020 He Had The Balls to Come, The Gall to Die, and Then Forgive Us. I wonder what he thought it would get us. Amazing freaking song. So try to follow that one. No, but he wants to go next. This is about as heavy as it gets, right? Yeah, this was pretty much the heaviest song on the album, you know, lyrically and even musically, I guess. I don't know. It, you know, it was, 00:46:00.760 --> 00:46:08.760 just a totally heavy topic and I guess I don't know it's like there's nowhere else you're 00:46:08.760 --> 00:46:12.820 going to put this on the album right you can't put it anywhere else it's got to be at the end you can't 00:46:12.910 --> 00:46:18.420 follow it yeah exactly and it's too like you know you're not going to follow this with days and days 00:46:18.660 --> 00:46:23.160 right I mean it's right you know it's like you can't what you're going to where are you going to put it you 00:46:23.300 --> 00:46:29.700 have to put it at the end and unfortunately like it's just like it's devastating like because you you come 00:46:29.700 --> 00:46:58.340 off this beautiful song that is sad. Joey is not really all that uplifting because it's really talking about somebody who has an addiction problem. And then you get into this, which is even heavier and worse and not nearly as beautiful as the song before it, but beautiful in its own way, which is just this sad, melancholy thing. 00:46:59.300 --> 00:47:28.720 So yeah, this, you know, I don't think I expected this after like the gang vocals and bloodletting and the vampire fun in New Orleans, you know, it's like, oh yeah, this is not that. And so, yeah, this, this album was pretty diverse in terms of, as you go through it, you know, all the different kinds of moods and, and various perspectives and things that were going on. And, you know, this is about as, as heavy as it can be. So, yeah. 00:47:29.500 --> 00:47:58.360 While Not Being a Heavy Song. Yeah, just wanted to make that clear to listeners that it's not thematically heavy for sure. Yeah, exactly. TR meant to say it's heavy, man. It's heavy. Yeah, I like this song a lot. I like the kind of ethereal, dreamy feel, which goes against the whole subject matter of the lyrics, you know, but I kind of like that about it. Again, you know, I'm hearing that kind of desert-y, 00:47:59.300 --> 00:48:29.220 guitar playing that kind of even adds more to the atmosphere. And so, yeah, it's, this could only be at the end. Again, a great tracking move too, because it's the cover song on the album to put at the end. And so. Yeah, you should definitely listen to Andy's version as well. It's very good. Yeah. And, and I'm assuming that was written X number of years prior to this. It was not that long. It was like how Ozzy did Hellraiser and then, 00:48:32.400 --> 00:48:59.000 I think it was within like a year or two or possibly in the same year. It was not like years. Okay. It's no, it's a great way to end the song. And it, you, for me, I felt like I was drifting off with the album as it was closing. Meaning like it just, you know how songs end. I think we mentioned this last time about, I like how songs sometimes don't end it. You get the full ending to hear the band finish playing. This is a song. You don't want to hear the band finish playing. 00:48:59.300 --> 00:49:28.000 We wanted to just fade out and just drift off because of what you've listened to up to this point. So I like that they did that for this song. Yeah, they both came out in 90. Wow, that's cool. All right. Any last comments on Concrete Blonde before we move on? I can't say enough. I love this album so much. Clearly more than some people, but that's not meant to be a dig. It's just me saying, hey, 00:49:29.300 --> 00:49:57.040 Oh, this is an album that means a lot to me. No, I liked it. I thought it was a good album. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. There were definitely parts of this that I really appreciated. That's all I can ask. As long as you didn't come on here and just thumbs down, this stunk, then, you know, I'm good. Nah, her voice is tremendous. Isn't it though? Yeah. Yeah. All right, let's move on to TR's album. 00:50:01.500 --> 00:50:29.260 Theories of Flight, released July 1st, 2016. It's a relatively recent release. And of course, for those of you that probably may not be as familiar, Fate's Warning has been around since the early 80s. They've had numerous different lineups, but Jim Matheos, the guitar player, has been on every album and is the main songwriter. And the early albums, I think they wanted to sound like Iron 00:50:29.300 --> 00:50:33.560 and Maiden, but they became like the godfathers of prog metal. 00:50:36.019 --> 00:50:44.440 And over time, they really established their own sound, and there's nobody that sounds like them, and they don't sound like anybody else. 00:50:45.380 --> 00:50:53.800 So their original vocalist, John Arch, left in 1987, and Ray Alder joined the band, and their sound continued to evolve over the years. 00:50:54.660 --> 00:50:57.920 But they are firmly in the progressive metal genre. 00:50:58.760 --> 00:51:28.480 So this album was, I guess, their, I want to say, second to last album. Jim Matheus has basically said that he feels like he did everything he's going to do with Fate's Warning. So he, they, their last album, they put out Long Day Goodnight a couple of years ago. 2020. Yes, thank you. And, and basically closed the book on Fate's Warning. They haven't ruled out touring. So a Fate's Warning tour might happen, but, 00:51:28.740 --> 00:51:56.860 And really, I feel like they might surprise everybody in a few years. I don't know. Who knows? But I think, I don't know, I have a hard time believing that's the end of Fate's Warning. Because Matthäus isn't that old, and I feel like some inspiration is going to hit him. And I don't know. We'll see what happens. Arch Matthäus. That could happen too, which was really outstanding. And that'll be another podcast. 00:51:57.120 --> 00:52:22.080 So this album, again, 2016, starts with a song called From the Rooftops, which has a pretty mellow opening and goes on for about two minutes with this kind of mellow vibe, but then bursts in with a heavy but melodic section with multiple parts and cool harmonies. 00:52:23.800 --> 00:52:53.720 It was an unexpected beginning to this album. Lyrically, it makes you feel pretty small. When you have a lyric that there's nothing that time can't end, that makes you feel like, I guess there's not a lot we can do about anything. No point in driving now. Yeah, exactly. But that all said, it's a strong song. Even though it has this mellow opening, the drumming is outstanding. 00:52:53.820 --> 00:53:22.200 on that mellow part. And then it really, like when it picks up, it just really propels. And Bobby Jarzombik, who's the drummer for this band, for this album, adds this dimension of propulsion through this whole album. But then he can lay back and do this mellow stuff as well. And I just love what he does on this album because all of the people on this album are fantastic. 00:53:22.380 --> 00:53:52.160 Like the musicianship on this album is outstanding. And then, and so is, is Ray Alder's vocals throughout this whole album. So that's the intro for the, from the rooftops. I'd like to hear what you guys have to say. So this one for me starts off in typical Ray era fates, soft and pretty fashion. And yes, that's a generalization based on very little factual input. Zero. 00:53:54.920 --> 00:54:22.240 It was just when I heard it, I was like, oh yeah, here we go again, Ray. Which I don't know where that comes from because he's always been a belter of a singer. I know. I'm making fun of myself here. Okay, this is me making fun of my stereotypes and lack of knowledge of this era of Fate's Warning because I'm a huge Fate's Warning fan from the Arch era. But I'll get to that later. Like I said, I could be wrong. 00:54:22.380 --> 00:54:52.200 I was maybe thinking of Dream Theater. I don't know. It's the same thing, right? Ooh, that hurts. But then halfway through the song, it gets all heavy, which is bitching. And I dug this too. I liked it. All right. I'm just messing with you. I think he's warming up. He's stretching a little. Yeah. So full disclaimer, Fates is, Fates Morning is one of my favorite bands of all time. I know we all say that. They are firmly entrenched in my top 10. 00:54:52.380 --> 00:55:21.860 I don't say that about them at all. Yeah. Kidding. So I will say that I am overly biased about this band. I will make one correction to what TR said, and I'm adamant about this. They only have one album where they basically impersonated Iron Maiden, and that was their very first album. Because their second album, nobody was doing what they were doing on that one, which was The Spectre Within, and then it was followed up by, 00:55:22.380 --> 00:55:50.940 many consider one of the greatest metal albums ever made. I know George would agree with that. And that is what album, George? Awaken the Guardian. Yes. Which nobody sounds like. I mean, you can't find anyone that sounds like that album. So, Tiara is correct in saying that this is a band that every album has changed a little bit and a little bit. And to the point now where this band doesn't sound anything like they did when they first came out. No. 00:55:51.620 --> 00:56:21.460 They've evolved so much. And just to be clear, I said that they started out wanting to sound like... No, I know. But I thought you had said the first couple albums. I was like, whoa. Fight! Fight! Fight! No. I agree with you, John. It's true. They quickly found their footing and their sound evolved rapidly and has continued to evolve. Rapidly is a great word to describe it. Perfect word. 00:56:21.620 --> 00:56:50.640 So to the song itself, I absolutely love this song. Tiara and I were very fortunate to literally be sitting in front of Joey Vera when they played at Rams. Rams Head on stage. On stage. I was trying to remember which one it was because there was at the time four of them. So it was in Annapolis. I knew that part. And it's a dinner seating type theater, which was so depressing that they were playing there. 00:56:50.700 --> 00:57:20.640 But they were so close to us. It was amazing. And this song was a song they opened up the tour with. And like George said, it does start out. Hey, hi, guys, we're here. And it's very subtle and very kind of mellow. And it's got some very tasty, classy guitar work from Jim Mathios. There's this great little drum fill to kick it off. And then you just get pummeled like a steamroll. 00:57:20.720 --> 00:57:21.940 just squashed you. 00:57:22.940 --> 00:57:40.100 Because the drumming on this album from Bobby Jarzombek, and if you've ever listened to our other podcasts, outside of me having to say my contractual, you know Scott Travis has been in Judas Priest for 30 years, I talk about Bobby Jarzombek all the time. 00:57:40.100 --> 00:57:41.200 I absolutely love his playing. 00:57:41.880 --> 00:57:46.980 This band has been blessed with three great drummers, all completely different from each other. 00:57:48.160 --> 00:58:17.980 And T.R. is right when he said that there is like, this is like 1.2 gigawatts have been added to the band. 1.2 gigawatts! He really does bring, and the interesting is, the guy they had playing them for the most of the time in the band, Mark Zonder, is an incredibly gifted drummer. He's amazing. And they did things that were completely different with him because of his style. And Bobby just brings power and technique. 00:58:19.040 --> 00:58:20.440 without being techie. 00:58:21.140 --> 00:58:25.760 If you know anything about metal, he's not a techie drummer, meaning he's not blast beating you all the time. 00:58:26.260 --> 00:58:27.660 Although he's blasting you with beats. 00:58:27.980 --> 00:58:28.400 Yes. 00:58:28.800 --> 00:58:29.400 There's a big difference. 00:58:29.700 --> 00:58:30.880 It's totally tasteful. 00:58:31.280 --> 00:58:32.580 Is he the watchtower guy? 00:58:33.800 --> 00:58:34.300 His brother. 00:58:34.380 --> 00:58:34.760 His brother. 00:58:34.860 --> 00:58:36.340 That's why I thought it might have been his brother. 00:58:36.440 --> 00:58:36.580 Yeah. 00:58:37.220 --> 00:58:37.980 Ron Jarzombek. 00:58:38.020 --> 00:58:38.200 Ron. 00:58:38.340 --> 00:58:38.480 Yes. 00:58:38.660 --> 00:58:38.920 Thank you. 00:58:39.860 --> 00:58:40.260 Absolutely. 00:58:41.660 --> 00:58:43.220 Insanely gifted guitar player. 00:58:43.660 --> 00:58:44.720 And they just. 00:58:45.920 --> 00:58:47.100 So just to give you a quick thing. 00:58:48.240 --> 00:59:16.840 He plays with Fate's Warning. He has played for Fight with Rob Halford. He plays with Sebastian Bach. He's his longtime touring drummer. I don't even know if he's on the albums. And he plays with George Strait. That's all you need to know about this guy playing stuff. Great opener. Right off the bat, this album is definitely heavier for them. It's very technical. Joey Vera on bass. If you don't know who Joey Vera is, 00:59:17.140 --> 00:59:46.100 He's their long-time bassist. What's the black metal band he's playing with now, George? Merciful Fate. He's their bass player. Just incredibly gifted bass player. Ray Alder's vocals are probably his best he's had in years on this album. The choruses are simple. They're short. They're easy to distinguish. That gives Ray the ability to sing even better. 00:59:46.180 --> 01:00:09.760 And I will say this album for them, it's a progmat album, has a lot of hard rock sensibilities in it, in the choruses, which I think sets this album apart from their other albums. So great intro song. I won't say any more about it because I have so many notes on this album and I really don't want to take up too much time. I'll get all that stuff out of the way so that everything going forward will not be as blabbermouth-ish. 01:00:11.020 --> 01:00:39.580 Yeah, I have to admit, I was surprised with how heavy this album was overall. Yeah. I expected it to be heavy, but not quite as in-your-face heavy. So I was like, yeah, nice. Yeah. This is a locomotive coming at warp 11. They've hit plaid. I didn't see you playing with your doll, sir. Yeah, so the second song is, 01:00:39.840 --> 01:00:40.580 Seven Stars. 01:00:41.580 --> 01:00:45.520 And this is a little more straightforward of a song compared to the first one. 01:00:46.080 --> 01:00:47.460 Lyrics by Ray Alder. 01:00:48.380 --> 01:00:50.880 He married a Spanish woman and moved to Madrid. 01:00:51.270 --> 01:00:56.640 And the title refers to Madrid's flag, which is a red flag with seven white stars. 01:00:58.240 --> 01:01:02.040 And basically he moved there to be with her. 01:01:02.680 --> 01:01:05.420 He got married, moved from the U.S. 01:01:05.560 --> 01:01:08.280 He's always been in the U.S. for his whole life. 01:01:09.240 --> 01:01:38.120 And it was a big leap for him. And you can tell that he felt it was something he had to do. And when you listen to the lyrics of this song, you know, I'll never be the same. Seven stars, destination, calling my name. You know, it's he's he knows it's what he has to do. But it's like you can tell there's like a little bit of apprehension. But like this is the start of a new chapter. And it's a love song in some ways because, you know, for him to make this leap. 01:01:38.860 --> 01:02:08.460 He's got to go for it. And I don't know. This song is excellent performance and completely inspired on everyone's part. The lyrics are inspired. The music is inspired. It's a powerful song. The drumming, you know, propels it. I just I really love this song and it just kicks so much ass. I love this song. Yeah. The ass that it kicks is so much ass. I can't help myself. But yes. 01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:38.840 So there you are. Yeah. I liked this one too. And if I'm not careful, you're going to get me to go back and listen to some of those Ray albums that I skipped. Didn't you guys say that No Exit was kind of okay? Yeah, we can discuss later. That was a loaded question. I was expecting outrage at me saying that it was okay. So this is where I talk about John Arch because I was a huge Fates fan when our 01:02:38.860 --> 01:03:08.480 was in the band, you know, mid to mid, mid eighties, essentially early to mid. And when, you know, I was a fan of the band in the moment. So when he left, I was outraged and left. I think, I believe he was fired. And so Ray had the odds stacked against him for, for my side of the court. When he came in, I'm like, you replaced my singer that I like, you better be great. And I was like, eh. And so when no exit came out, I was like, eh. 01:03:08.860 --> 01:03:38.540 And I never really gave it much of a shot. So I should probably go back and listen to that. I would say for that album, you may still not care for his vocals because he tried so hard to emulate John Arch because he was such a huge Fates fan before he joined the band. And you don't start to see him find his voice fully, I don't think, until parallels. But you, Pleasant Shade, or not Pleasant Shade, Perfect Symmetry is where he starts to be himself a little more. 01:03:38.580 --> 01:04:08.200 But it doesn't come to full fruition, I think, until probably Parallels. And to be fair, I went back and looked at the albums, and while I didn't really listen to No Exit, I did like the three after that. To an extent. You know, there were singles that were good. I was like, hey, it's all right. Yeah. No Exit's more in the vein of Awaken the Guardian, but it's getting proggier. Every Gated Dreams is like an epic. 01:04:09.660 --> 01:04:36.480 But let's get back to seven stars. Because I don't want to derail this anymore than I'm going to. And we will. Yeah. So Tiara, you mentioned something that just resonated with me even more about the vocals, the lyrics, and especially in the choruses. Because the whole time I just kept picking up how simple he made his lyrics. Because we think about it, the lyric is seven stars, destination. 01:04:38.580 --> 01:05:08.540 how he phrases that and how he's able to drag that out without making it like some operatic singing but you almost feel like you could sing like gray alder when you're seeing them play this live because of how he phrases the words and how he has just enough time in between when he says seven stars and then destination you want to get out there and sing it with them i can't sing to save my life i may i lose my voice after the first song i try to sing and that's the beauty of the song 01:05:08.540 --> 01:05:10.260 is that everything about it, 01:05:10.840 --> 01:05:14.340 everything about everything on this album is in the right place for the right reasons. 01:05:14.800 --> 01:05:17.080 Everything Jim is they host did when he wrote these songs, 01:05:17.490 --> 01:05:18.960 he put everything in the right place. 01:05:19.780 --> 01:05:22.480 And I had mentioned earlier about subtleties. 01:05:23.280 --> 01:05:25.380 This album is loaded with subtleties. 01:05:26.460 --> 01:05:28.060 Bass and drums on this album, 01:05:28.580 --> 01:05:28.760 you know, 01:05:29.000 --> 01:05:31.560 the backbone of the band is so solid and so good. 01:05:31.880 --> 01:05:32.900 And you're right here. 01:05:32.930 --> 01:05:34.120 It shines on this song. 01:05:34.260 --> 01:05:38.520 Bobby Jarzombik is a beast on this without hitting you over the head with 01:05:38.540 --> 01:05:43.040 all these blast beats yeah his fills are all everything is in place where it should be 01:05:44.140 --> 01:05:51.720 and something that they do really cool and they have since post inside out which is going back to the 01:05:51.740 --> 01:06:08.500 mid 90s is that jimathos's guitar sound for me as a non-guitar player is my favorite what he does and he does this thing where he has these underlying melodies and then he comes over on top of it with this heavy 01:06:09.020 --> 01:06:36.740 Progmedal riff. He does that throughout this whole album. And they sound so different, but they sound like they should be together. And so the thing about this album is the foundation of every song is there, and he just tweaks it a little bit for certain parts. And I'll bring that up a few more times to just give the song a little bit of variance, but the song still remains the same. Little Zeppelin. I was going to say. Thank you. So it's a great second song. I agree. 01:06:37.500 --> 01:07:07.440 And the beauty of this is that it only gets better from here on out. So a lot of melodic guitar on this one, I think, more than most songs. I agree. Before and after the chorus, he does a lot of really cool kind of, I wouldn't say it's like, you know, melodic metal, you know, from the early 90s, but he has a lot of melody in his soloing right before Ray comes in to sing his parts. Yeah. And so much of this album is really melodic and very catchy. 01:07:08.420 --> 01:07:37.460 which, you know, it's technical, but it's catchy. And I think it's just a really good mix of all of that. So it scratches every itch for me anyway. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I agree with that. A lot of, I think a lot of things I take issue with Prague is that it isn't, it's technical, but it's not catchy. I mean, I'm not saying that all is like that, but when I'm not a fan of it, that's generally one. 01:07:38.160 --> 01:08:07.420 Yeah. So, and I would agree with that. This does not suffer from that. No. Yeah. But yes, but there's enough technical stuff going on that. It's just loaded with technical stuff. It is, but they've like somehow, I don't know. They don't browbeat you over the head with it. Yeah. Yeah. And right. And that's, you could say that about the drumming too, right? Like it's technical, but you don't get, you don't get beat over the head with it. It's just, it's tasteful. And, and it really compliments the song. 01:08:08.280 --> 01:08:09.800 and propels the song. 01:08:10.740 --> 01:08:13.880 And so, yeah, I just, man, I love this album so much. 01:08:14.500 --> 01:08:22.560 Let's move on to the third song, which is S.O.S., another heavy tune, but then it mellows out kind of in the middle and slows down. 01:08:24.000 --> 01:08:30.100 And ultimately, like, so S.O.S. is lyrically sink or swim. 01:08:31.000 --> 01:08:31.960 And he's talking about. 01:08:32.640 --> 01:08:33.460 Oh, is that what it is? 01:08:33.920 --> 01:08:34.060 Yeah. 01:08:34.120 --> 01:08:34.279 Yeah. 01:08:35.180 --> 01:09:03.220 And so a lot of this album has to do with making a move and doing something. And this is no different. And so in this case, you know, it's just, okay, you know, you get like a lot of lyrical content about the rain kind of being like initially kind of a problem undermining him. But then it also acts as something that can wash the pain away. 01:09:03.400 --> 01:09:32.799 So you get these two different looks at the same thing. And basically, sink or swim, you know, it's like you've got to, and we'll get to another song later on in this album, but it's just like, look, you got to put up or shut up pretty much. And this song, you know, it's just, it's heavy and it gets the point across. Interesting. Put up or shut up. So I didn't read the lyrics, so I took it as, 01:09:32.960 --> 01:09:59.560 the typical SOS, Save Our Ship. In this case, it meant Save Me, I might be enjoying this too much. I like that they've certainly got a melodic streak, but they still managed to toss in a lot of heavy riffs. But you know what would really spice this album up even more? What's that, George? The odd harsh vocal hair in there. Just a little bit of, you know, a little Tom. Tom Deathender once in a while, right? 01:10:02.960 --> 01:10:32.920 Tom has gave us the greatest gift of metal ever yeah but you're correct that is also the entirety of you suffer by napalm death as well I know I love it with one drum beat yeah again I love every song on this album and this is no different than anything else and it's just getting better for me as the song goes on it comes in with heavy guitars heavy bass and drums and like TR said it then 01:10:32.920 --> 01:11:02.400 into this middle section after the first chorus. And there's this kind of almost haunting guitar work in the background. And that's all you hear. And then Bobby Jarzombe comes in with this drum beat and it's setting this situation up. And then there's this weird looping sound. I don't know if it's on guitar or bass because there are no, I didn't notice any keys or synths listed on the album because I thought maybe Jim Athios was patching something in or looping something, but there's some kind of, 01:11:02.920 --> 01:11:32.900 almost like Joey Vera's doing something with his bass guitar to create this kind of moaning sound a little bit and it's leading up to one of Ray's best moments on the album is when he sings the vocal sink or swim which comes up after this everything about this song is just awesome and all the subtleties I talked about especially during this slower part of the song where you've got this kind of melodic rhythmic guitar playing going on and then Jin comes in with this heavy 01:11:34.000 --> 01:12:02.100 MF and riff. It's huge. You know, and it's these little subtleties that he puts in that you might say, oh, it's just part of the song. Yeah, but he didn't need to do it. And most bands would probably really screw it up bad. And he did it just right. And it's symptomatic of the whole album. He's doing that the whole album. So it's just three bangers in a row. And I say that for a reason, because the next song we go into kind of changes things up a little. 01:12:02.200 --> 01:12:04.360 Yeah. So, TR? 01:12:04.630 --> 01:12:32.120 Yeah, so the next song is The Light and Shade of Things, one of the two songs on the album, Over Ten Minutes. It starts real mellow, mysterious, a beautiful vocal delivery by Ray. The song is about a friend who had a substance abuse problem who ended up dying. In Jeff Wagner's book, Destination Onward, which is the fate's warning story, 01:12:32.580 --> 01:13:01.680 Ray says that this song is one they spent the most time on. And the song runs the gamut of every emotion from sadness to pain to anger and even a little bit of hope at the end. The song musically passes through each of those emotions and you can hear it musically and lyrically. It's very powerful. Ray delivers an amazing performance. It's really one of his most epic. 01:13:02.780 --> 01:13:30.860 performances and the band as well. Again, it starts quiet and Ray, you know, giving this beautiful kind of vocal delivery, but then it gets really angry and upset and it just goes through these various emotions of pain and anger. But then it ends on like, yeah, you know, it talks about, you know, throughout the song, he's, you know, it's hard to find a heart that's there inside. 01:13:32.180 --> 01:13:34.120 And then at the end, he's like, I know 01:13:35.300 --> 01:13:36.080 the heart's there. 01:13:37.000 --> 01:13:38.880 And that's just like, it hits you, man. 01:13:38.960 --> 01:13:39.880 It's like this song. 01:13:40.600 --> 01:13:42.960 And he even said, like, it was hard doing this song 01:13:43.120 --> 01:13:44.640 because it's about a real person. 01:13:44.820 --> 01:13:46.900 It's about a person he cared for. 01:13:47.040 --> 01:13:48.180 It's their tomorrow ending. 01:13:49.340 --> 01:13:49.740 Exactly. 01:13:50.220 --> 01:13:50.800 Yeah, essentially. 01:13:52.460 --> 01:13:56.020 And he said, you know, doing this live was really challenging 01:13:56.240 --> 01:13:58.520 because, you know, it's hard not to get choked up about it. 01:13:58.800 --> 01:14:00.720 And it really does run the gamut. 01:14:01.240 --> 01:14:30.680 This song is, I don't know, it's really an epic tune on this album and I really feel like, and not only that, but like it's, it has catchy lyrics too. You know, the light and shade of things, like the chorus is huge. And then, you know, like I said, the lyric of, you know, it's hard to find a heart that's there inside just really hits you. And so, yeah, this is one of my favorites on the album. Mine too, actually. 01:14:32.300 --> 01:15:00.440 Yes, this was one of the two long ones. And the guitars early on made me think of Pink Floyd, particularly the leads. Gilmore-esque kind of stuff, you know? Definitely the centerpiece of the album. And I think it was intended for that to be, this is a song that's going to stand as it's the second longest song. It's not the longest song, but only by what, 15, 20 seconds, maybe. Agree with you guys, everything you said about this. I love the atmospheric start to the song. 01:15:00.520 --> 01:15:30.500 that kind of feature a quiet ray singing it's almost delicate and i hate to use those for that word you know for a metal album or a prog metal album but it is almost i wouldn't say the guitar work is bluesy george you made me think now it's more like david gilmore which this stuff is a little bluesy at times but it's atmospheric bluesy which is different yeah i heard that again later too i was like oh yeah more fluid and and i and i kind of like that more and i like blues 01:15:31.480 --> 01:15:34.220 It's almost like he's just sitting around noodling around 01:15:34.450 --> 01:15:36.200 The difference is he doesn't keep noodling 01:15:36.810 --> 01:15:38.240 He does something with it 01:15:38.340 --> 01:15:39.580 He makes something out of it 01:15:40.160 --> 01:15:42.320 And it's really cool how the band kicks in 01:15:42.480 --> 01:15:44.040 It's a very proggy song 01:15:44.300 --> 01:15:45.940 It's not the proggyest song on the album 01:15:46.440 --> 01:15:47.760 It's the second proggyest song 01:15:48.520 --> 01:15:50.980 And it just so happens the two proggy songs 01:15:51.180 --> 01:15:52.340 Are proggyest songs on the album 01:15:52.440 --> 01:15:53.400 Are the long ones 01:15:53.810 --> 01:15:55.460 I know, cliche, I get it 01:15:55.680 --> 01:15:58.620 I love the middle section with the acoustic guitar 01:15:59.840 --> 01:16:28.420 It conjures up Rush to late 70s when they would do these cool little acoustic guitar interlude things and then go off again. And they're big Rush fans, which is funny. It just reminded me of that. It doesn't sound like Rush. It just reminded me of something Rush would do. And I will say this. Like Rush, the sound of this band evolved. There are very few bands, 01:16:28.800 --> 01:16:56.820 where, you know, their sound evolves so dramatically over time. And I would say, like Rush, this band's sound really evolved and their albums, you know, each of their albums has a different sound. Maybe not to the level of Rush, you know, when you think about like. Right, they're still in their lane. Yeah, exactly. They're on their highway, I should say, which means they're deviating from lane to lane, but still on the same highway. Yeah. 01:16:56.880 --> 01:17:26.660 I will say in Fates Warning's favor, they never put out an album called Hold Your Fire, and they never wrote a song called Dog Years. So, just saying. Meow. Doggy. Just saying. Just a couple more things about this song. I agree with everything you said, Tia, about the emotions of the song, because it does feel uplifting at the end. Like, we can see it's the end. We can see the light at the end of the tunnel kind of thing a little bit. All these songs, 01:17:26.880 --> 01:17:56.860 specifically this song and one other song at the end of the album that are long it doesn't feel like 10 minutes and i think that's a testament to a good well-written song is that if you don't feel like it's dragging on it could be 15 minutes you still wouldn't feel that that's a good it's a well-written song to keep you engaged the whole time yeah so yeah and so the next song is i felt was a really good follow-up to that because you know if you think 01:17:56.900 --> 01:18:26.200 Think about what happened to this guy and ultimately what happened. The next song is called White Flag. Another really heavy tune. And essentially, Ray's lyric is don't give up, right? It's a gritty lyric. It's a gritty vocal delivery. No surrender. Don't give up. Never carry that white flag. You know, rise and bury your white flag. And it's just like unrelenting, you know? 01:18:26.240 --> 01:18:52.840 And you feel like in some ways, it's almost a response to the song before it. Like, you know, just don't give up, keep going. And, you know, maybe his reaction to maybe what happened there. But I don't know that. Obviously, that may or may not be true. But that was the vibe that I got from it, you know, in the placement of the song and what it says and what it follows. 01:18:53.860 --> 01:19:21.320 One of the nice cool things about this album is you have a couple of solos on this song delivered by other members of either the touring band or the longtime guitarist Frank Oresti, who had been in the band about 20 years at different times throughout the band's career. Mike Abdow, who was also a touring member of the band in later years, delivers a solo at three minutes and 15 seconds. 01:19:21.480 --> 01:19:51.440 Frank Resti gives a solo at around 342, which is pretty cool that it's a nod to the other guys in the band and they deliver, you know, excellent solos in this song that really complement the heavy nature of this song. So I was hoping this one was a Dido cover, but it wasn't. You know, he's telling me not to surrender here, but I think 01:19:51.480 --> 01:19:53.820 I'm going to have to cry uncle and admit this is a cool album. 01:19:54.120 --> 01:19:54.840 So yeah, 01:19:56.050 --> 01:19:57.120 I guess that's why you picked it. 01:19:57.240 --> 01:19:58.340 I thought you were going to go with that. 01:19:58.410 --> 01:19:58.500 George. 01:19:59.900 --> 01:20:00.720 I fool you. 01:20:01.220 --> 01:20:01.900 You fool me. 01:20:03.040 --> 01:20:03.140 Yeah. 01:20:03.240 --> 01:20:03.300 No, 01:20:03.330 --> 01:20:03.720 it's good too. 01:20:04.860 --> 01:20:05.220 Agreed. 01:20:05.660 --> 01:20:05.880 Again, 01:20:06.240 --> 01:20:11.240 I agree with ETR that it's the placement of the song and the, 01:20:11.680 --> 01:20:16.100 the tempo of the song really are a good followup to the light and shade of 01:20:16.180 --> 01:20:16.280 things. 01:20:17.120 --> 01:20:44.540 I'm going to bring Iron Maiden back into this conversation because, you know, I like to make these observations that, see, nobody said anything. So you learned from the first time tonight, not to say anything until I finish my comparison here. This is a Iron Maiden-esque type song because there's a little bit of a giddy up in this song. The drums and the riff and the guitar have a little bit of a, you know, kind of thing going on. 01:20:45.180 --> 01:21:14.880 And the reason why I bring that up is because when Ray sings some of his vocal parts, especially towards the end of the song for the chorus line, you know, rise up and bury your white flag, they kind of rein the band back a little bit and let him stand out so that the drums and the bass are not this thundering kind of locomotive sound. But then they kick right back in when he tells you to bury that flag. So it's almost like you can almost sense that the person's given up, they're given up. 01:21:14.920 --> 01:21:44.560 And it's like, no, keep going. And then here they come with that full bull rush into your face again. And I think that kind of really gives the song a unique flavor to it. Again, a really simple lyric to remember. And I can't remember lyrics. I can't sing to save my life, but I remember these lyrics. And I especially love the last line, you know, when he says that rise and bury your white flag, bury and hold your white flag. And he holds that last lyric at the end. 01:21:44.580 --> 01:22:14.480 And he just lets it rip. He spits it out. Yeah. But he doesn't screech it. No. Ray learned finally, because he threw his voice out, you know, X number of years prior to this. Just let it ride. And he lets it ride. And it sounds so good. It really does. Ooh, let it ride. There we go. So another great song. I mean, like I said, and this will come up at the end. This album has risen so far up my list from when it first came out. 01:22:14.580 --> 01:22:43.680 to where it now sits in the Pantheon Face Warning albums. And it's because of this album is so good. There's reasons. So let's kick it. I'm with you. Okay, so the next song is Like Stars Our Eyes Have Seen. And this, it's a heavy song. It's another heavy song, but it's catchy. It starts out really heavy and driving. And the chorus is just so melodic. I'm not sure what this song is about, really. 01:22:43.720 --> 01:23:12.620 You get glimpses lyrically of darkness and fleeting things and hardships. But whatever it is, it seems profound. And there are these real syncopated sections. The song, again, it's heavy, but catchy and technical. So it's a mix of things that you wouldn't expect necessarily to be. And again, a melodic chorus. I really like this song. It's just, it's, 01:23:13.220 --> 01:23:42.980 It's everything that I want at all. Fate's warning, really. So my eyes have seen you. I mean, like stars, our eyes have seen. I got it. So while I think this song is cool, this is the part of the album where I started feeling a little bit of prog fatigue. Yes, the song is cool. I'm not knocking the song, but I started feeling things. 01:23:43.200 --> 01:24:13.140 We're starting to sound a little samey. So that's the perils of listening front to back in one setting. So to be fair, I at this point tapped out for the day and after this song, listen to the last two songs the next day. So to be fair. So this is my favorite song on the album. Well, I should probably listen to that again. No, it's quite all right because this is a relentless album. Even the light, 01:24:13.260 --> 01:24:43.180 The Shade of Things, which is probably the slowest song on the album, that's not saying much. And so, George, I get it, because the technicality and the riff on this one, this is by far the heaviest song on the album, I think. When it starts, it's the closest you're going to get to an Archmeteos song, I think, minus the chorus. If you take the chorus out of it, this is very Archmeteos-like. It's heavy as anything, and it's relentless, and there's 01:24:43.200 --> 01:25:11.260 probably more footwork from Bobby Jarzombik, more bass work on this song than on the whole album. He is constant on this. And this is another song I talk about, Subtleties. The underlying theme of the song stays the same, but they just kick it up a little bit in certain parts. Bobby Jarzombik will do a little more. He'll add a little more. It's not blast beating, but he'll add a little more. Then he'll rain it back. 01:25:11.320 --> 01:25:13.400 You're right, a lot of footwork that he's doing. 01:25:13.900 --> 01:25:22.360 And then the guitar, you guys can speak guitar language, but it almost feels like you've got the rhythm guitar playing. 01:25:22.840 --> 01:25:27.320 And then he just changes where he is on the neck of the guitar to give it just that little bit different sound. 01:25:27.400 --> 01:25:35.220 He's still playing the same structural, you know, this song is still the same, but he's just changing the, I guess, the notes or whatever of the song. 01:25:35.380 --> 01:25:38.300 It's just all these subtle little changes are in this. 01:25:38.860 --> 01:25:39.720 It's got a great chorus. 01:25:40.020 --> 01:26:08.980 Again, it's that whole prog metal with these kind of hard rock sensibilities and the choruses. They're easy to remember. Even though this one's a little wordier, you still remember it. It's not like, I don't know, some bands I hear their choruses, I'm like, this is just garbage. I don't want to hear this anymore. Garbage. Everything seems to be in place again. I like this song maybe because it is so technical without being techie. Again, it's heavy. 01:26:10.420 --> 01:26:39.800 I love the fact I keep harping on it and I'm going to harp on it again on the next album. I love the subtleties of this because to me I'm hearing certain things that I like and I come from the drum side of things and while I never played bass I identify with bass more than guitar because I listen to the bass because I'm playing drums but I'm providing bass work when I played and so and we don't have even talked about Joey Vera that much he's outstanding 01:26:39.840 --> 01:27:09.800 on this album as the bass player. I agree. Speaking of drummers, did you hear about the band that locked their keys in the van? They had to break the window to get the drummer out. Yes. Thank you, George. You're welcome. All right. Song seven, The Ghosts of Home. It's another 10 minute song. And this time the music and lyrics come from Jim Mathios. He moved around a lot as a kid and the loneliness and alienation that comes with being constantly 01:27:10.060 --> 01:27:39.800 uprooted comes across in this song. It's imagery of a young boy's life broken up by various moves, fleeting glimpses of things that didn't last. A lot of the lyrics, you know, home again, home again, and basically saying, okay, you know, I keep moving, and now this is home, and now this is home again, and now I'm moving again, and now I'm somewhere else, and, you know, just 01:27:39.820 --> 01:28:09.800 The middle of the song kind of has an uplifting sound to it. Even though, you know, it's all these kind of lyrical things that kind of speak to being uprooted, not having any kind of real constancy and the loneliness and not connecting with people and just constantly moving. The middle of the song kind of has this uplifting feeling, despite 01:28:09.840 --> 01:28:36.740 All That, which I found interesting. But yeah, this isn't, you can tell like this album, the album is starting to wrap up and it's another epic song. And yeah, this is another great song on the album. Yeah. So this is where I tap back in. I love the bright, clean guitar tone at the beginning of this song. It goes well with his vocals. And then the song gets heavy when Rush shows up. 01:28:39.840 --> 01:29:09.800 I gotta say this Matheus kid plays pretty well so he might have a future at this I really like both of the long epic songs on this album it's good stuff it really is so no joking I dig it so good to hear that because it is a great song it's another song that's this is the longest song at ten and a half minutes and it doesn't feel like it for me what I got out of this I'm interested to see what you think TR is that you know they start the song out with this kind of samples 01:29:09.820 --> 01:29:39.600 You're getting some audio sounds that it sounds like somebody's changing the dial on a radio, like a hand radio. And you're hearing that it's coming, cutting in, you're hearing voices. And it's hearkening to another project that Jim Mathios was involved with. And I didn't say something for the last song because I had to flip my page and I missed my last two notes for the last song. But you're starting to, this is the part of the album where it happens. 01:29:40.360 --> 01:30:09.760 There's a little OSI vibe on this in parts. And OSI is Office of Strategic Influence, which was a side project from Jim Athios that he did with Kevin Moore from Dream Theater, who had left. And it featured... See? Same band. Yeah. Well, you have to throw Mike Portnoy in there. He was on the first two albums, and Gavin Harrison from Porcupine Tree was on the next two, and Sean Malone. Unfortunately, he's passed. Great bass player. 01:30:09.840 --> 01:30:38.220 from the band Cynic. Stephen Wilson from Porcupine Tree sang a song. Mike Ackerfeld from Opeth is saying on a song. Tim Bonas from No Man. It's all these different bands in the world. Yeah. And the first album really was for that, Matt, for that. And you're just getting a little bit. It's almost like, hey, OSI is not gone. They're just not doing anything anymore. And there's a little bit of that showing up here. Just in small doses, though. Yeah. Like a sprinkling. Yeah. 01:30:39.820 --> 01:31:09.800 song at the ending was like that and it adds to the allure of the song when this song finally kicks in in about two and a half minutes i get a total pleasant shade of gray vibe a little bit there the rhythmic playing and the the beat from the drums yeah what they're doing it has that this is by far the progress song on the album yeah and there is a lot of push and pull on this album yes or on this song i should say which is very mark zonder like drumming you know and 01:31:09.820 --> 01:31:39.640 It's great. It's heavy still. Again, memorable chorus parts. I won't waste any other time to say that. Everyone shines on this album. And there's that. I will say, I love even the next song. I love it. Had they ended on this song, it would have been more than fine to end here if they wanted to. I agree. They could have. But in true Jim Mathios fashion, he loves to add. 01:31:39.820 --> 01:31:41.640 Interesting closing songs. 01:31:42.300 --> 01:31:43.060 Just one more. 01:31:43.640 --> 01:31:44.420 Just a little more. 01:31:44.510 --> 01:31:45.320 Just a touch more. 01:31:45.750 --> 01:31:47.980 The final song is Theories of Flight. 01:31:48.800 --> 01:31:53.380 And it's an instrumental coda to The Ghosts of Home, which was the previous song. 01:31:54.520 --> 01:31:57.960 And it's, for the most part, an instrumental piece. 01:31:58.080 --> 01:32:06.560 However, there are some, there's a female interviewer asking questions that seem very closely related to Matthäus' life. 01:32:07.440 --> 01:32:35.160 But it actually came from an art installation of a lady named Karina Tinker called The Differences Between Houses and Home. And Matthäus got the rights to use it and it works very well, especially after Ghosts of Home, because the questions that she's asking are, it's almost uncanny how they relate to his life and the moves that he was making and the things that were going on. 01:32:36.060 --> 01:33:04.680 It's not surprising that he seized on this because it couldn't be more fitting to go with, to go as a coda to the ghosts of home. And in the book, you know, Destination Onward, they talk about like basically like how Matthäus basically said that he, you know, he felt like the questions were like a therapy session where you hear the question, but he didn't want any answers. 01:33:04.880 --> 01:33:27.140 So there are no answers. It's just the questions. And so I kind of found that interesting. So I feel like it's, you know, it's a relatively short piece, but it's a fitting end to the ghosts of home and like an instrumental coda to that I think really ties in well with the song before it. 01:33:28.060 --> 01:33:57.740 So your discussion there made me think about this title a little bit. You know, theories of flight. I'm like, okay, Wright brothers, you know, flying. Yeah. Okay. Now I'm thinking flight might mean to flee. Yeah. Mind blown. Yeah. Woo. So yeah. Takes a little longer for my brain to blow, but there it goes. Yeah. Uh, I said more vaguely pink Floyd light guitars at the beginning. 01:33:58.540 --> 01:34:01.800 I like the build up to getting heavier and then it gets quiet again. 01:34:02.900 --> 01:34:06.020 I felt it was an anticlimactic ending for the title track. 01:34:06.220 --> 01:34:07.320 That's also the last track. 01:34:08.020 --> 01:34:11.140 But when you mentioned it as a coda, that makes perfect sense to me. 01:34:11.300 --> 01:34:12.460 So I will go with that. 01:34:13.300 --> 01:34:14.440 Still thought it was an interesting tune. 01:34:15.580 --> 01:34:15.760 Yeah. 01:34:15.940 --> 01:34:27.980 It's, it reminds me a lot of disconnected part two from the disconnected album that came out in 2000, where it ends with instrumental after just a behemoth of a song and still remains. 01:34:28.040 --> 01:34:58.000 which is one of their most epic songs. This song just has the feel of OSI across the board. It's very electronic, but then there is some great guitar-based drum thing there in the middle, just a short piece, but it has that kind of vibe. And Jim Athios has always been interested in electronics and creating soundscapes, and he's quite good at it for someone who doesn't do it all the time. I wish he would do more. I wish they put on another 01:34:58.060 --> 01:35:27.840 OSI album. Yeah, they won't do that. It's never going to happen because Kevin Moore is a doctor now. Yeah. So, um, yes. I, I, again, like I said, had they ended on the ghost of home, it would have been perfect ending. But for me to get a little bit of fates warning meets OSI at the end, I will take it just from that kind of very basic level. But to put it in the context, like, 01:35:28.040 --> 01:35:28.140 said, 01:35:28.340 --> 01:35:30.220 TR that is a closing song. 01:35:30.340 --> 01:35:32.560 It's closing this album out at this. 01:35:32.740 --> 01:35:33.620 This is the final code. 01:35:33.920 --> 01:35:35.240 It's the final chapter of the album. 01:35:35.640 --> 01:35:37.340 It's the final countdown. 01:35:38.160 --> 01:35:48.040 It's kind of thematic for the three albums we picked that all three closers kind of have a reason for being the closers in their own way. 01:35:48.180 --> 01:35:48.640 Good point. 01:35:50.100 --> 01:35:50.220 Yeah. 01:35:51.100 --> 01:35:55.240 So I just have a couple more comments overall about this album and, 01:35:56.120 --> 01:36:26.060 And the comment that I want to make goes back to Ray. There are lots of layered and overlapping vocals throughout this album. And in the book, Ray said that he worked harder on this album than any other Fates album. And to me, it's clear. There's an energy and an urgency to this record. The music from Jim, Matthäus, and the rest of the band is super inspired, but it's matched by the inspiration that Ray put. 01:36:26.100 --> 01:36:56.020 on this and the level of work that he put into this, you can hear it. If you've listened to other Fates albums and you listen to this, the level of effort that Ray put into this, you can tell that he put more into this. And it's, to me, it was clear because his vocal delivery, the inspired lyrics, the, just the way that the marriage of the lyrics and the music, it, it just, it's clear that, 01:36:56.100 --> 01:37:26.080 Everybody was inspired for this. And I just, this is one of my favorite Fates albums, if not the, you know, it's definitely top three because it's just a tremendous album all the way through. And I really love it. And yeah, I'm glad we could talk about it today. Yeah. All, uh, prog jokes aside, I want to thank you for putting this on this episode because it inspired me to put the discography on my 01:37:26.120 --> 01:37:30.600 I found and work on going back and listening to this stuff that I haven't heard. 01:37:31.120 --> 01:37:32.040 So broad nerd. 01:37:32.380 --> 01:37:32.880 Yeah, it's me. 01:37:33.720 --> 01:37:34.720 I'm happy to hear that. 01:37:34.840 --> 01:37:35.780 I'm glad you liked it, George. 01:37:36.400 --> 01:37:36.880 Good stuff. 01:37:36.900 --> 01:37:37.380 Like TR. 01:37:38.000 --> 01:37:38.380 I agree. 01:37:39.260 --> 01:37:44.480 This is a very strange theme that I've come up with, and it's completely unintentional. 01:37:45.300 --> 01:37:51.000 But it seems like all these albums we're talking about, if I'm going to rank them, they're all ranking at four. 01:37:51.540 --> 01:37:54.860 And I don't know why that is for me right now, but that happened on the first episode. 01:37:55.500 --> 01:38:25.460 It happened with Judas Priest, I think. I don't know what's going on. I'm ranking albums around four and five. And this falls at number four for me for Fate's 13 albums. It's an outstanding album. I'll keep it really brief. Everything just seems so natural and effortless, which is interesting because they put in a ton of effort. And I think that's what putting in effort does. It makes it sound like it's effortless. Everyone's humming. Like we said earlier, it's a low 01:38:26.320 --> 01:38:55.100 Everyone has their part to play and everyone plays it perfect. I think what also sells this album is for me is the writing was some of the best. It got to a tired, not a tired sound, but almost like we need a break at some point, a little bit in some of their albums. Yeah. And it's not, there's not one bad album, even not a Brock is not a bad album, but there's something you could say, maybe they needed to just go on vacation this year. You know? 01:38:55.500 --> 01:38:56.340 You don't have to tour 01:38:57.660 --> 01:38:59.320 So I'll say this real quick 01:38:59.900 --> 01:39:01.200 Had this been their last album 01:39:01.720 --> 01:39:03.460 This would be in the pantheon of great 01:39:03.960 --> 01:39:04.880 Closing albums for me 01:39:05.320 --> 01:39:05.520 Yes 01:39:05.680 --> 01:39:07.360 These are metal albums I'm going to mention now 01:39:07.820 --> 01:39:08.280 I don't TR 01:39:08.340 --> 01:39:08.900 I don't know if you know this 01:39:09.040 --> 01:39:10.320 George will definitely know these 01:39:10.900 --> 01:39:12.100 But had this been their last album 01:39:12.160 --> 01:39:14.100 To me it would be on the level of Celtic Frost 01:39:14.240 --> 01:39:14.900 Monotheus 01:39:15.080 --> 01:39:15.380 Oh yeah 01:39:15.560 --> 01:39:15.820 You know 01:39:16.000 --> 01:39:17.920 Or Bolt Thores for those loyal 01:39:18.120 --> 01:39:18.380 It's just 01:39:18.660 --> 01:39:20.260 It's that strong at the end 01:39:21.020 --> 01:39:23.060 And I would have been happy had they ended 01:39:23.320 --> 01:39:24.800 Although I'm still happy we got 01:39:24.800 --> 01:39:53.640 the last album, even though it's a decent album. I'm still glad we got it. Whatever you think about this band, whether you like it or not, it's hard to deny how professional they sound and how classy they are. They're not wankers on their instruments. You know, Frog gets a very bad rap, and rightfully so in a lot of cases, for being overindulgent and pretentious. They tend to rein that in fairly well. And the final thing I'll say is, 01:39:54.820 --> 01:40:23.280 Theos is a prog god, and he doesn't get enough credit for how influential he has been on the prog metal scene. Dream Theater rightfully gets pegged as the linchpin that got all these bands to follow, even though they're not the first. And Queensryche gets some. I think Queensryche is overly put into that. I don't think they're overrated for that. And I think Fate's Warning is underrated for it. 01:40:23.540 --> 01:40:23.740 Yes. 01:40:24.120 --> 01:40:36.720 And I would even, even to, you know, to underscore that, you know, even Mike Portnoy was like pretty much. Yeah. You know, we might be in that category, but Fates was doing this way before us. 01:40:37.010 --> 01:40:53.380 They wanted their first album. They sound a little bit like Fates Warning on their first album to some degree, just a touch a little bit. They do. Yeah. So, and there's a nice relationship between the two bands because Kevin Morris played on Fates Warning's albums. And I will say, this is the only band I know of that's got, I think, 01:40:53.420 --> 01:41:23.400 12 members, maybe I'm wrong, maybe 13. They all still seem to get along to some degree. Yeah, they've all gotten together for, you know, they had the parallels reunion. They did the Archmeteos stuff, like the original lineup got together for Awaken the Guardian. The Awaken the Guardian lineup got together. Yeah, I should say. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, the fact that all of those guys still get along and can put that stuff together and do it, I think, is remarkable because, you know, they're all still 01:41:23.440 --> 01:41:27.460 They're still friends and they all still get along. So I think that's a testament to 01:41:28.120 --> 01:41:31.560 the fact that these guys, you know, care about each other and 01:41:32.480 --> 01:41:34.800 you know, musically they enjoyed working together. 01:41:35.560 --> 01:41:38.680 Yeah. So that said, if you're interested in 01:41:39.020 --> 01:41:42.260 listen to something a little heavier and more technical, jump on in. 01:41:43.240 --> 01:41:44.880 Come on in. The water fine. 01:41:45.580 --> 01:41:48.460 TR, I don't know if you, do you remember my friend Robert from the saloon? 01:41:49.060 --> 01:41:52.860 Yes. Robert used to say, come on down, baby. 01:41:52.940 --> 01:41:54.100 I like that all the time. 01:41:55.780 --> 01:41:57.280 So and he had just a perfect voice. 01:41:57.540 --> 01:41:58.400 So that's right. 01:41:58.580 --> 01:41:58.860 All right. 01:42:00.020 --> 01:42:00.660 Take us home, John. 01:42:01.780 --> 01:42:03.440 Oh, that was good. 01:42:04.040 --> 01:42:04.160 Yeah. 01:42:04.700 --> 01:42:06.620 Two good albums to talk about so far. 01:42:07.080 --> 01:42:07.320 Yeah. 01:42:07.520 --> 01:42:08.700 Real quick, TR. 01:42:09.020 --> 01:42:11.440 What is one and two for you on the Fates? 01:42:13.480 --> 01:42:14.220 That's tough. 01:42:14.660 --> 01:42:15.760 You got to know if you have. 01:42:16.260 --> 01:42:17.500 I'm going to put this at three. 01:42:17.740 --> 01:42:20.260 I don't know where all the other albums go, but this one's going to three. 01:42:21.560 --> 01:42:21.840 Yeah. 01:42:22.860 --> 01:42:51.380 So Pleasant Shade of Grey is up there. I really love that album. Me too. That's my number three. Okay. Yeah. To me, that's probably... If you don't know, that's fine. Yeah. It's hard to say. That's definitely up there. And, you know, Parallels is a good album. What's number one? I like Disconnected a lot. You know, a lot of people... I love Disconnected. That's number five. Yeah. So I've never really ranked them. I really need to think about it more. Try it. It's really hard. 01:42:51.400 --> 01:43:21.180 Who is number two? I am number one. So number two for me? Awaken the Guardian. Yeah. What's number one? Perfect Symmetry. Wow. Absolutely love it. It's along with Watchtower, it's where you finally get to hear what prog metal is supposed to be. Because everything was 80s power metal based. You know, US power metal and perfect symmetry just right from the get go is just pure prog metal. So. 01:43:21.400 --> 01:43:50.360 Because like you said, George, nobody thought of Fate's Mourning and Awaken the Guardian and Spectre Within as prog metal. That was just considered metal. Yeah. If anything, power metal, because power metal was different back then than it is now. So anyway, just curious here. Thank you for trying to indulge that and then not being able to do it because it's so... I was completely incapable. Sorry. No, it's really hard to do. All right. So we come to the third album of tonight's podcast. 01:43:51.420 --> 01:44:21.100 For my pick, I went with an album that is the same name for four different albums from this person's catalog. And I'll explain in a second. We went from prog metal greats to a prog icon. My pick is Peter Gabriel. And the album is Peter Gabriel, also known as Peter Gabriel three, also known as Peter Gabriel melt. 01:44:21.860 --> 01:44:51.380 because he didn't want to name his albums for his first four albums and he was forced into it on the U.S. distribution for the security album so all of a sudden we have names for these albums the first album which was just Peter Gabriel is now called Car because he's in a car second album is Scratch this one is called Melt because the iconic album cover of his face melting this was his third album as we said came out May 30th 01:44:51.400 --> 01:44:58.860 1980 recorded in the summer and fall of 1979 and the reason why i bring up the dates is 01:44:58.980 --> 01:45:04.880 because this album is like nothing peter gabriel had ever done before up to this point in his career 01:45:05.760 --> 01:45:15.080 it is a combination of art rock post-punk progressive pop new wave this is there's no hogweeds in this 01:45:15.160 --> 01:45:44.460 There's no carpet crawlers. Supper's not ready. There's no knife. You know, there's not a musical box. You know, this is different. It's even different from his first two albums, which were more kind of rock based, although the second album experiments a lot more. This is full on in a different territory. And I'll go as far as to say is Peter Gabriel and David Bowie during this period influenced so many new wave artists. 01:45:45.160 --> 01:46:15.100 to go in all these different directions. The differences here is that while there's a lot of sense, it's not cheesy sense that the 80s was plagued with. This is an album full of layers, subtleties. I've brought this up before. Lyrics that really have you thinking. He gets a little political on this album with a couple songs, which he's not preachy at all. There's nothing preachy about his politics. It's almost pointing out some things on one side. 01:46:15.140 --> 01:46:43.960 and then telling a story in another. So much so that one of these songs, which we'll get to at the end, became hugely influential in a certain country of some inadequacies, to put it very mildly. We'll get to that, though, at the end. It spurred on a whole level of awareness that people didn't know or didn't seem to understand, all from a song. 01:46:44.280 --> 01:47:14.220 and a very simple song at that. So real quick, like all his early albums. So his pre so album, which everyone knows. So because the sledgehammer in your eyes and that voice again, and big time, his four albums up to this point all had a big hit on them and they were all very artsy and different. And so like we talked about what concrete blonde and like I made the analogy of, and then there were three by Genesis. There's always the one big hit. 01:47:15.980 --> 01:47:44.140 And then there's the rest of the album. Because it does, those songs do stand out for him. Because he does cover so much different ground. I'd say there's at least two on here. There are two, that's true. I don't consider the last song to be a hit per se for radio. No. But it is a hit in itself, if you want to call it that. But yes, there are two on this. But there's one very big standout hit song on this album. This is the point I was trying to make. Just real quick for, 01:47:44.900 --> 01:48:12.700 Pointing out, some of his longtime band members are on this album, which makes a big difference because they've been with him for so long or in different parts of his career that helped create the sound. Tony Levin's on bass, who's a God bass player. Larry Fast from the band Synergy is his keyboard synth guy. David Rhodes, the guitarist, has been with him, it seems like forever. Phil Collins makes an appearance on this album, which is really important because we'll kick into that right away. 01:48:13.740 --> 01:48:43.300 Robert Fripp from King Crimson is on this album. Kate Bush actually shows up on this album first before she shows up on the album So. So to be redundant there, we move on to the first song, Intruder. Something about this album is very unique than other albums is that the lyrical content in song titles, the music matches the content. And this is a perfect example of it. 01:48:43.380 --> 01:49:13.340 It kicks in right away with this big, booming drum sound. Who happens to be Phil Collins? Which is quite interesting because that big, booming drum sound, which was discovered during these recording sessions, would go on to be a prominent drum sound all throughout the 80s. And if you don't know what I'm talking about, just give a listen to Power Station and Phil Collins' solo career. But I don't know if you guys have read anything about that. They stumbled on this gated reverb with the drums during the 01:49:13.920 --> 01:49:42.880 And it became pretty prominent throughout the 80s. Interesting. So the song is about an intruder. There's nothing more to say about the lyrics. It's about somebody breaking into your house. And it's from the first person perspective. And it's got this eerie, creepy vibe at the beginning. And it's almost got like music that you would hear for somebody breaking into a house. Now, this isn't like your bumbling idiot inspector Jacques Cousteau, you know, and the Pink Panther campiness. 01:49:43.380 --> 01:50:13.300 But it still has that kind of... Does your dog bite? That is not my dog. You have a bimp on your head. You idiot. So it's not that campiness. But it has that kind of vibe with the xylophone in there and everything. You just feel like you're with this guy breaking into someone's house. And it's a creepy song. Because you wouldn't know that dude was in your house. It's also a great song. And Phil's drumming on this. And I've been harsh on his drumming. 01:50:13.380 --> 01:50:40.520 in the past, but he's so good on this song, and it's very simple what he does, but it's very prominent, and it's a great way to kick off the album, and it sets the tone for the whole album. So I'll let you guys take it away now. All right. Am I the only one that when you see the title Intruder, you think, I thought Van Halen? Not that it would be a cover like White Flag. That's interesting. I did not think of that. But I was like Intruder. I was like, oh yeah, Van Halen. 01:50:43.400 --> 01:50:44.260 Oh, yeah. 01:50:45.450 --> 01:50:51.340 So I said this had a cool beat and it was ominous sounding, which obviously being about intruder, it would be. 01:50:52.430 --> 01:50:57.840 You know, I want to point out that I don't actually have a lot of history with most of the songs on this album. 01:50:58.900 --> 01:51:02.720 For years, I've always been, you know, a fan of the Peter Gabriel hits. 01:51:03.100 --> 01:51:03.580 Everyone knows. 01:51:04.110 --> 01:51:09.520 It was only in the last few years through knowing John that I decided to dig deeper into his catalog. 01:51:10.520 --> 01:51:11.540 Dig in the dirt, if you will. 01:51:12.860 --> 01:51:42.080 and become entranced by him. So I dig the album and, you know, there are a couple of songs on here that I really dig, but I am not as well versed as you guys probably are. But I thought it was a great opening track. Yeah, this really sets the tone for the album. John, you summed it up. This is, it does not get more authentically creepy than his delivery in this song and the lyrics that he's singing, you know. 01:51:42.860 --> 01:52:12.180 It's just creepy. Like, you know, talking about, you know, he's going to slip through all your dainty things in your underwear drawer and like just really nasty stuff and slipping the clippers through the telephone wire and I'm cutting off the phone so you can't call out and just, you know, I'm happy in the dark and it's just. And add that xylophone and it gives that kind of 60s like movie vibe. 01:52:12.260 --> 01:52:37.000 It's almost like a disturbing circus sound. And one of the things that, you know, one of the challenges that he set to the drummers on this album was you're not using any cymbals. There are no cymbals on this album. And I'm sure, you know, Jerry Morata is the other percussionist on this album. 01:52:37.090 --> 01:52:38.520 Who didn't particularly care for this. 01:52:38.620 --> 01:53:08.580 Yeah, it was a challenge. And I know like, you know, when you're used to using cymbals, you know, that's a part of your palate as a drummer. And, you know, he's pulling them out of the drum kit and saying, no, you're not using that. I'm sure it was like, what? You know, like, what are you talking about? Like, you can't just remove. That's like saying, oh, you can't play these five notes. You know, I'm sure as a drummer, it was like, what are you talking about? Let's take away like some of like the main elements of, you know, how I play. 01:53:08.660 --> 01:53:10.820 and what I do. 01:53:11.340 --> 01:53:17.680 Not to catch up, it's a great point to bring out because when you play drums, you have accents when you're playing. 01:53:18.300 --> 01:53:22.720 And it cues the band also for certain things. 01:53:22.940 --> 01:53:28.000 And it makes light of something that you want to put as a centerpiece. 01:53:28.040 --> 01:53:28.840 So to pull that out. 01:53:29.000 --> 01:53:29.540 You can emphasize, exactly. 01:53:30.080 --> 01:53:31.380 And it's a note thing too. 01:53:31.700 --> 01:53:34.760 When you're counting, that's going to hit on a certain point. 01:53:35.320 --> 01:54:04.500 Without a hi-hat, how do you keep track of your timing at all? I mean, when I play drums, the hi-hat ties everything together. Yeah, so now you're on your floor, Tom, you know, doing that. Right, and that's, yeah, and it lends a much darker atmosphere to this whole album because you take away a splash or a crash or a hi-hat or any of that, and it just changes the tone completely. And so to have the foresight to be like, okay, 01:54:05.320 --> 01:54:33.600 I'm going to remove this element from my album. It's simple, but it's almost unthinkable. Like, who would do this? Peter Gabriel. Exactly. And that's what lends this dark sound to this album. And Intruder, again, it's like you've got these scraping guitar sounds and, you know, it's like he's creeping in and he's getting in the house and here he comes and it's like this nasty thing. 01:54:33.680 --> 01:55:03.540 I'm going to get you sucker. Yeah. It's, it's, it's just like, it's so effectively delivered in the way that he sings and the lyrics that he sings. Like he got into that space almost a little too much. And when you listen to what he's saying, it's like, okay, you really, you know, you got into this and it's just creepy. And this is the lead off track. You know, this is like, whoa, 01:55:03.660 --> 01:55:30.580 Okay, this is where we are. Okay, this is what we're starting the album with. Okay. You know, I was, you know, like looking at it now, I can't even imagine the record company was probably like, okay, this is commercial suicide. We're starting off the album with this creepy song that is that, you know, I just can't even imagine what they thought when they listened to this album for the first time. 01:55:30.980 --> 01:56:00.420 Yeah. And to see that, I personally think this is his gold standard, this album. I know a lot of people disagree and say so is, but so is his hits album. No, that's a hits album. He never got more arty than this. Oh, this is, yeah, this is way off. Security had its, definitely had its points in its time, but like, this is even more out there than security in a lot of ways. It's just, there's, it's just, yeah. They're different artsy. Security is a lot more sparse. 01:56:00.480 --> 01:56:30.460 There's spaces filled on this album with different things. A lot of synth work that kind of fills in gaps that is not on security. So we'll move to the second song. And again, it's another, from the perspective of a person, the second song is called No Self Control. And it continues with this eerie feeling. It's loads of electronics. There's noisy guitar work from Robert Fripp. The song ebbs and flows. You get the feeling. You can feel the person who has 01:56:30.480 --> 01:56:59.740 has no self-control. There's an addiction here that they have to something in life. It's not really evident from it. It could be anything. But the way the lyric or the song ebbs and flows, you can almost feel like the person's building where they're going to lose their self-control. They can't contain themselves. And it does build up to a crescendo where that does happen, where the music, the whole band comes in and you get these heavy drums again. And then it just subsides towards the end of the song, almost like the person now is, 01:57:00.480 --> 01:57:30.320 There's a relief that I couldn't control myself, but now I'm back to fighting it. And the way the song, like I said, again, being redundant, saying ebb and flow, you can almost feel like you can feel the person's heart rate picking up throughout the song and then coming back down as they control themselves. It's a brilliant song, I think. It's one of my favorites of his whole catalog. And I like just about everything. After Up, I'm not so big on his stuff. 01:57:30.500 --> 01:58:00.460 But that's like basically 10 albums, including all the original soundtracks. I even like those. You just get the feeling you're in someone's mind is it's overactive and there's anxiety. You get that feeling in this and it's the lyrics are great. And he's really good at hyper focusing in on a subject and not browbeating the subject into you. And he's great at phrasing great second song. And you're just like, wow, I really like that. 01:58:00.520 --> 01:58:30.460 I feel like crap now after two songs because this is some dark eerie stuff yeah Pete seems to have a thing for mallet instruments on these first two songs but he manages to meld pop sensibilities with avant-garde strangeness and it just works which to me is just sort of Peter Gabriel you know that's two sides of the coin there so good tune yeah I like the percussive synths and again the drums are real heavy and low 01:58:30.480 --> 01:59:00.460 You got a lot of Tom work going on here. And yeah, lyrically, you know, it doesn't matter, right? What he's talking about, he can't control himself, you know? I'll call any number, so, you know, I'll talk to anybody. But he's also talking about all kinds of other, you know, ways of kind of not being able to control himself. And this whole album is like looking into a disturbed mind, pretty much. And it's disturbing 01:59:00.500 --> 01:59:05.020 just from the perspective of these songs are... 01:59:05.610 --> 01:59:10.440 As you go through these songs, and we'll get into each one of them, 01:59:11.090 --> 01:59:16.600 but every one of them has some kind of disturbing element to it. 01:59:17.660 --> 01:59:21.980 There's nothing normal about this album or comforting about this album. 01:59:22.180 --> 01:59:26.200 It's just odd. It's offbeat. 01:59:26.280 --> 01:59:55.420 And that's really what Gabriel was for those first three or four albums. He was odd and offbeat, right? Like his stuff was just different. And, you know, obviously even on So there are a couple of songs that are a little bit odd. You know, he never really gave up on that. But he became a little more mainstream by the time he got to So and it wasn't as peculiar or as disturbing as some of this. Don't get me wrong. 01:59:55.540 --> 02:00:25.520 he had plenty of stuff later on that was that you know was dark or disturbing or you know some of the stuff from birdie and the passion of christ or whatever the soundtrack stuff was a little darker but but these albums you know were a little strange right like these early these first you know his first three or four solo albums were peculiar and this especially this whole album is a study on on on the on a disturbed mind pretty much 02:00:26.580 --> 02:00:55.400 Agreed. All right. So the third song is called Start, and it's a short instrumental. I won't spend too much time with it. You may not think it's necessary in the album, but the way it flows into the following song, it just works. It just feels like it's so seamless in the way it transitions. It's this short instrumental. It's got a little bit of a jazzy feel because there's a little bit of sax. 02:00:55.540 --> 02:01:24.660 So our good friend Matt from the Metal Hits Podcast will like this song. It's Saxalicious for him. But it's a new wave song too a little bit. And it reminds me of David Bowie's song Subterraneans off the album Low. I just read about that. What's that? I just read about that because he wrote it for the man who fell to earth and it didn't get used. So he put it on. Yeah. Yeah. And so it has that little bit of vibe. It doesn't sound anything like it, but it has that kind of aesthetic that is similar. And. 02:01:25.560 --> 02:01:55.480 It builds and leads into the following song. I don't remember. Now, I'm going to stop there so I can hear what you guys say, but there's not too much to say other than it flows into the next song. I thought it was, I laughed because I thought it was funny because I said five words. I said, pretty, but not super necessary. And you said, it's kind of necessary. And so I was like, all right, you know, throw up all my papers, walk away. I give up. No, not at all. I mean, I think most people would say, 02:01:55.560 --> 02:02:23.280 this song's not necessarily in the album. I guess I just like how it flows into I Don't Remember. Just because of how I Don't Remember starts. Maybe that's why I like it so much. Because it's so different. They're completely different sounding songs. Anyway, TR. Yeah. No, I agree. And I've always looked at this as the beginning part of I Don't Remember. I don't really look at Start as a separate song. I look at it as the prelude to I Don't Remember. 02:02:26.520 --> 02:02:31.420 I don't remember. I don't really think of them as separate songs. 02:02:32.430 --> 02:02:48.680 But I agree. It cleanses the palate after the first two really weird songs. And then you get this kind of jazzy thing that's like, okay, yeah, we're going to do this little kind of thing for a little bit. And then, yeah, you know, then you go right back into this disturbing stuff again. 02:02:48.820 --> 02:03:18.780 So it's like a little sorbet before you get into the next course, I guess. So basically what Peter Gabriel's done is he's given you a chance to take a hit off the oxygen tank. Clear mine for a second. Because this rolls right into the second hit off of this album, which is called I Don't Remember. And it's one of his bigger songs. I think it gets a little lost in his catalog of 02:03:18.800 --> 02:03:48.780 great songs because he had so many big hits after this album but i would put it up there pound for pound you know or note for note with a lot of his hits as being better because there's this kind of jarring bass rhythmic thing going on here from tony levin who makes his appearance on this song with his chapman stick if you've never seen the chapman stick look it up so you can see it's hard to explain it's a giant 02:03:50.100 --> 02:04:18.520 stick with strings on it, but like thousands of strings, you know, it's like millions and millions of stars, you know, kind of thing. It's like 16, I think on there. I'm not mistaken. I can't recall, but it's, it's, you don't remember. It's, you don't recall. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, thank you for getting it. It's tapped. You know, you play like almost like a piano, right? Like it's two handed, two handed. You've got usually, 02:04:19.380 --> 02:04:48.080 with the stick, you've got one hand doing kind of a rhythm thing, and then you've got another hand kind of tapping out a melody or other notes. And so one's kind of keeping a rhythm with a bass line, and then the others are adding some flavor. Right. And so you finally get to hear that on the album. Tony Levin is famous for that. He's not just a prog rock god for bass playing, but he's just a great bass player overall. He's played with a bazillion people. 02:04:48.820 --> 02:05:18.780 But his two main acts are Peter Gabriel and King Crimson. The song features Robert Fripp on guitar, and you can tell it's Robert Fripp because you've got these kind of, there's no scratchy going on here, but there's these kind of just abrasive sounds here and there. But it's a catchy tune. The lyric for I don't remember is catchy as anything. It's a radio hit song, but it's nothing like a radio hit. That's what makes this song so great, is that it got tons of radio hits. 02:05:46.020 --> 02:05:48.660 I said, here we have the first earworm chorus. 02:05:49.260 --> 02:06:18.760 You know, it just gets, builds a trench in there and just doesn't want to leave. It's one of the songs that I knew previously. And that's a great tune. Love it. No complaints. Yeah. My notes here, again, Levin on the stick, he does a lot of slides and what I call squibs, where he's going, you know, like you're getting these kind of peculiar, weird sounds out of the stick that he's doing. 02:06:19.320 --> 02:06:48.460 that he does elsewhere on the album. But this is the first song where you get a lot of that. And, you know, it's a notable kind of signature sound for him. And again, like you said, you've got this, you know, I don't remember, I don't recall, I've got no memory of anything at all. And just like this disoriented feeling throughout the song of, you know, I'm not sure where I am or what's going on. And, you know, that's, 02:06:48.800 --> 02:07:18.760 It follows after this creepy intruder and this, you know, I don't have any self-control and I don't remember anything. And it's just like, you know. Now it's Monday and you're in front of the class without your homework. Exactly. It's like, you know, this just this kind of like losing your mind pretty much like that. Everything on this album feels like that. But you're right. There's like this catchy feeling to it that, you know, it shouldn't be as catchy as it is. 02:07:18.800 --> 02:07:24.840 because it's like wow you know and i gotta say if you listen to that if you go online and 02:07:25.400 --> 02:07:32.740 look at youtube and you you watch his 1978 rock palest you know live version of this you know which was two years 02:07:32.880 --> 02:07:40.840 before he recorded the album he's got different lyrics and it's you can tell it's a few revisions from being done 02:07:41.640 --> 02:07:48.780 and i like the way that he ended up finishing it off on this album because i think it's a much better 02:07:48.800 --> 02:08:17.500 than the live version that you hear on that 1978 show. Can I just break in here for a moment? Because that makes me think of his forthcoming album or whatever it is. I owe. Yes, I owe. I would like to know what he's releasing one song every month this year. Right. Yeah. Until it's done. But he's not just releasing one song. He's releasing two versions of the song. Yes. And I'm like, 02:08:18.800 --> 02:08:48.540 Is there a third version that's on the album? Is one of these going to be on the album? And the other not? Are they both going to be on the album? What do I buy here, people? Do I wait for the album and buy that? Do I go out and buy both of these songs now because I want to hear them now? What is going on with this album, Peter Gabriel? It's been hard for me because I want to like this stuff, but I just have not really cared for anything he's put out. I liked a couple of them so far. I don't know. 02:08:48.600 --> 02:09:18.560 He's been like all his music sounds pedestrian anymore and I don't know if it's just because he's getting older or what but I just it's disappointing and I know what you mean George you know he's got these different mixes and the whole idea is like he's got these two guys that are doing these different mixes and I guess he wants everybody to have the opportunity to hear how it might sound or the light version and the dark version yeah exactly so but yeah 02:09:18.580 --> 02:09:48.460 I don't know. It's a long way from, you know, Peter Gabriel 3, I'll tell you that. I felt pretty much everything after Up, and I'm not so up on Up. I think it's a decent album, but everything since Up has been down. But with that said, up to that point of Up, you know, I've liked everything. I'm going to have to make a decision here soon because I'm going to see him next month in D.C. 02:09:49.020 --> 02:10:18.120 Capital One Arena. Anybody going? Hit me up. We'll meet up. Pull the trigger on that. But I'm looking at Setlist FM and he's playing a bunch of these songs so I'm going to have to listen to them. Yeah, I will give him all the props in the world for not capitulating and playing hits. Yeah, there's only like five songs I know that he's playing. Yeah, and it's all new stuff and I don't have a problem with that. I know some fans get upset about that but this guy's never been about let me do this for you. 02:10:18.180 --> 02:10:47.780 Yeah, I'm not surprised about it with him. I'm going to see Springsteen next month as well. And he's even worse. He's only playing like three or four songs I know. Yeah. Like he's not doing Born in the USA or a lot of stuff. You know, he's doing like Dancing in the Dark, Thunder Road, and like one other one. Yeah, he definitely. And then he's just, I was like, oh, it's, I've never seen him. I like him. I know you're not a fan, John, but. 02:10:48.200 --> 02:11:18.160 It'll still be cool to see him even though I don't know most of the songs. Yeah, I wouldn't be opposed to seeing him just so I could say I saw him, but that's like me going to see the dead and I was the only like sober person there. Yeah, it's not doing the river. Come on. And I saw I went to see the dead just so I could see them one time so I could say it and I was just like I don't need to hear any more of their crunchy grooves, you know, so. All right. So now we move into a 02:11:18.200 --> 02:11:48.160 very bleak part of the album and that's the fifth song called family snapshot to me this is one of his crowning moments in his whole career this song because it kind of this isn't new for him but this is the song i think that exemplifies a classic peter gabriel type moment which is him playing on a piano or a synth or keyboard by himself singing and the song starting to build up 02:11:48.180 --> 02:12:18.120 around him to a big, huge moment only to finish with him again by himself, just playing and singing. And this song is that song. It's based on Arthur Bremer, who in May 15th, 1972 attempted to assassinate George Wallace, Democratic Party politician, and kind of used that moment to create a narrative for himself. 02:12:18.160 --> 02:12:47.240 to make himself famous. This guy realized that you could be famous by doing something like this and you'd be all over the news. You'd be on the evening news. Then they'd be talking about you in the morning. And he... Jodie Foster might even, like, talk to you. Yeah, he just... Wrong guy, I know. No, but the point is there. He just felt like he had a platform to get his popularity. And that's what he used was assassination. Go figure. 02:12:48.200 --> 02:13:18.100 Anyway, without wasting time on him, that's the content of the lyrics. And it's about him. It's him, actually, I think the character of the song itself. And it's a little depressing, especially when you get to the end of the song. But the song is gorgeous. The way it's written, the buildup from him starting at the beginning to the assassination part in the lyrics, the band builds up and it feels like you're there. 02:13:18.160 --> 02:13:48.120 as the motorcade is coming, because that's how he attempted to assassinate him on a motorcade. To me, it's one of his standout songs. I think he still does play this song quite a bit live when he does play live. I'll let you guys say more if you want about it. There's not much more to say other than if you haven't heard this song and you don't understand what I mean by Peter Gabriel's style here, you need to listen to it both on album and live, because while it's the same song, they hold different types of weight the way it's presented. 02:13:49.360 --> 02:14:18.140 I love the stripped down vocals start of the song his voice sounds great the lyrics are much darker than you would think from new music as you mentioned I felt this was a little less avant-garde than the rest of the album so far more just a powerful emotional song yeah it's deep it's heavy man yeah this is another disturbing song on this album and again you know 02:14:18.180 --> 02:14:45.700 just like in The Intruder where he assumes the role of this horrible person, he's getting across like, okay, I'm the assassin. This is what I'm doing and I'm going to be famous and everywhere he goes is news. I'm going to be the news now because I'm going to take this guy down. And the lyric is like, I don't really hate you. I don't care what you do. 02:14:46.380 --> 02:15:14.680 But, you know, this is how I'm going to get my fame, which is really disturbing. The whole, this whole song is just really disturbing. And, you know, there were also some visions of the Kennedy assassination in this as well that, that, you know, get assimilated with the rest of it, which was, you know, very clearly a horrible time in everyone's mind to, to think back to that. And yet, you know, 02:15:15.500 --> 02:15:45.440 He creates this character and then draws it all back at the end to this little kid in a room who doesn't get any attention from his parents. And it makes you think to yourself, okay, could all this be preventable if we had just paid attention to this kid? Or if we had just done something a little different in the formative years of this child? 02:15:46.300 --> 02:16:15.460 And, you know, it's a psychological song where you can tell he got into this to figure out, okay, you know, where does a person go wrong? Where does it happen? And, you know, how extreme can it be? And this is pretty intense. The whole concept of this song is pretty heavy and very disturbing. And you're right, John, he played this on the Up Tour and he played it on the So Back 02:16:15.540 --> 02:16:44.340 to Front Tour, both of which I saw, and live, his delivery is always very intense. There's an intensity of this, of Peter Gabriel live, that is really amazing. Seeing him live is, George, you're in for a treat if you haven't seen him before. I don't know if you have. Okay. Even now, I guarantee you, 02:16:45.480 --> 02:17:15.260 You know, obviously it's not going to be, I don't think, nearly as intensive as it was like, you know, many years ago on some of his earlier tours, but you're still going to feel that intensity that he delivers on these songs. And I think that's one of the things as a live performer that he always delivers. And yeah, you're going to enjoy that show. I just couldn't pull the trigger because to me, like I saw him on the So Tour when he was still playing some of these songs. 02:17:16.239 --> 02:17:42.420 And, you know, he was still doing Lay Your Hands on me on that tour and dropping into the audience, which I still can't even believe. And that was intense. I just feel like nothing he would do now would ever live up to those early tours that I saw with him. So I can't bring myself to go to this tour. But anyway, this is a very intense song and live. It's also intense as well. 02:17:43.300 --> 02:18:11.900 Yeah, I agree. I saw him on the Secret World tour, and it was crazy. And even though there were more hits on that tour, he still plays a lot of other stuff in there. And the band's outstanding, and there's theatrics on there, and it's great. I should point out something I haven't mentioned yet about Peter Gabriel, about his vocals. He has a unique voice. It hasn't changed much most of his career. 02:18:12.900 --> 02:18:42.120 He's not a belter. I would not say he's a technically high-end type singer, skill-wise. But he has a unique kind of raspy voice that seems to lend itself really well to his subject matter, whether it be in Genesis or Solo. And that doesn't deviate much. He can get pretty high sometimes, although I do think he uses some effects on some of his live stuff to help that out. 02:18:42.920 --> 02:19:11.559 But I think it sets the tone to some of these songs that you have this bleak, dark feeling. And here comes that voice. And you're like, oh, my goodness. Yeah. Oh, he definitely can. And I will say his voice has gotten a lot deeper over the years. Yes. Because if you listen to the re-recorded Lamb stuff, you can definitely tell the young Gabriel versus the older Gabriel. Right. When they did the, you know, the re-recording of the live Lamb shows. But yeah. 02:19:13.500 --> 02:19:42.440 If you listen to it, it's pretty clear. Like, okay, this is the older Gabriel. Okay, here's the younger Gabriel. Yeah. Not as many theatrics in his vocals anymore like there used to be. Yeah. So let's flip the record over to side B and kick off song number six and Through the Wire. Or actually, this is the final song of side A, I guess. I don't know. I have to look. I got to pull out my vinyl. This is probably one of the two more straightforward songs on the album. 02:19:42.999 --> 02:20:12.240 It's for the most part a rock-based song, but with his kind of art-rock, new-wavy sound to it, though. It's a cool tune. I've always felt it was an underrated. It's a very deep cut for him, but I always felt it was somewhat underrated. I've always liked it. It's got a nice chorus, nice buildup. Nothing so special about the song. I just think it's a very good kind of rock song for Peter Gabriel. There's nothing super artsy about it. It's, for the most part, fairly straightforward. It's got a catchy chorus. 02:20:12.480 --> 02:20:42.460 You know, they sing And Through the Wire. It's cool. I like it. You know, it gives off the impression that lyrically it's about a long-distance relationship. That's what I read everywhere. I think when you sit there and listen to it, maybe that's what it is. I think his lyrics are always left to be open-ended, unless it's like Family Snapshot, which is pretty hard to not think that's what it's about. I like this song, but I feel bad for it being sandwiched between the previous song and the next song. 02:20:43.220 --> 02:20:43.820 Oh yeah. 02:20:44.640 --> 02:20:45.740 It's a palate cleanser. 02:20:45.750 --> 02:20:46.140 No doubt. 02:20:46.680 --> 02:20:46.980 So, 02:20:47.320 --> 02:20:47.500 um, 02:20:47.610 --> 02:20:47.840 but yeah, 02:20:48.050 --> 02:20:48.380 good too. 02:20:50.020 --> 02:20:50.160 Yeah. 02:20:50.240 --> 02:20:53.840 This probably is one of the more rocking songs on the album, 02:20:54.370 --> 02:20:54.940 I would say. 02:20:55.660 --> 02:20:56.720 And so I would agree. 02:20:57.920 --> 02:20:58.260 And George, 02:20:58.420 --> 02:20:59.440 that's an interesting point. 02:20:59.440 --> 02:21:01.080 Cause I never really thought about it being, 02:21:01.770 --> 02:21:02.080 you know, 02:21:02.140 --> 02:21:03.680 sandwiched between those two songs, 02:21:03.900 --> 02:21:05.340 but yeah, 02:21:05.590 --> 02:21:06.580 I suppose that's true. 02:21:07.800 --> 02:21:08.020 I don't know. 02:21:08.020 --> 02:21:09.260 I still think it stands, 02:21:09.910 --> 02:21:11.540 it stands on its own pretty well. 02:21:11.640 --> 02:21:40.960 And it does rock. So, yeah. That's a little bit of vibe of the first two albums where he does a little bit more straightforward rock songs on them. Yeah. So, all right, let's get. Some people think this is the behemoth, the album. It's not. It's the hit of the album. It's not the behemoth. The behemoth is coming up. But this is his famous Games Without Frontiers, which if you know Peter Gabriel Music, you probably know this song. Joey. 02:21:44.899 --> 02:22:10.720 Up to this point, you know, if you think about it, his first four albums, he has these singular big hits like Salisbury Hill in the first album, Shock the Monkey on Security, which is his fourth album. Didn't really have necessarily a big hit off of the second album. I guess On the Air would be the closest from that one, but not really. Most casual fans wouldn't really know it. You know, Shock the Monkey in Big Time are songs that, 02:22:11.300 --> 02:22:40.840 I really don't care for. I like Shock the Monkey. I mean, it's okay, but I'm just not like, ooh, I want to hear Shock the Monkey or Big Time. No. I listen to Big Time for that little bass solo at the beginning of the song from Tony Levin. But anyway, I digress. It is, yes. It's easy to do. I do it all the time. This is Gabriel's, one of his two big political songs on the album. And while it's not necessarily preachy, he is, 02:22:41.320 --> 02:23:11.180 making some social commentary about world leader behavior and how childish they can be. And I believe it's a dig at Europe more so than the overall world stage. But I could be wrong about that. This is one of his standout songs. This is a weird song, too, because it shouldn't be a hit. It really shouldn't. He sings a little bit in French. He's got this, you know, lyric of Games Without Frontiers. And then you can hear the song when you just, 02:23:11.320 --> 02:23:40.300 Think of those three words. I'll let you guys talk more about it. I mean, I love this song. Yeah, it's one of his big songs, but I'll give you guys more time on this one. Along with Salisbury Hill, this is one of my favorite Rita Gabriel songs. And probably the first one I ever knew back in the day. Not only is it super catchy, but as you mentioned, the lyrics are an interesting take on world politics and war. I don't know about anybody else, but I've always connected all the names in the songs to kids playing and they're like playing. 02:23:41.320 --> 02:23:46.200 in a lord of the flies kind of way i i love a reference to tibet 02:23:47.420 --> 02:23:50.340 everyone has a hill to fly them on except for lynn taigoo 02:23:51.801 --> 02:23:56.180 that was very cool yeah it just at the surface it looks like a song about 02:23:56.820 --> 02:24:03.820 silly children playing but underneath it are atrocities it's his animal farm yes yes yeah 02:24:04.980 --> 02:24:07.720 obviously you know one of the bigger hits on the album 02:24:08.600 --> 02:24:37.700 And I remember hearing this on the radio quite a bit. I remember the video. Yeah. I have not seen that. I should see that. And yeah, just I guess I don't have a whole lot more to say than what you guys have said. But yeah, just definitely multiple layers to this song. And you're right, John. It's not you wouldn't think that this would be a hit because like you say, he's like he's singing in French and he's got like these kind of 02:24:37.740 --> 02:25:07.080 kind of weird tones and, you know, whistling and everything. Yeah. And just like everything. It's just a weird song, but yet it's very catchy. And I think that kind of happens throughout this album. Like these songs are strange and they're weird and they're disturbing, but yet like they stick with you and somehow, you know, it's just somehow bigger than all the weirdness that, that kind of it lives in. 02:25:07.740 --> 02:25:36.580 Yeah, it's really strange. He's a strange dude, right? He was always weird in Genesis and all the kind of peculiar little stories that he would tell in between the songs while they were tuning up. He would just do these weird stories. And then if you look at the lyrics to The Lamb Lies Down, it couldn't be more weird. And then, of course, his first couple of albums were strange and had weird lyrics and Moribund the Burgermeister or whatever. 02:25:36.640 --> 02:26:06.560 It is, but it's just weird, right? And so, yeah, this stuff, it's... But yet, he pulls it off. I don't know how he does it, but he makes it work somehow. And that's what I think is the most remarkable thing about this. Because you can't get more disturbing or creepy or weird than this album, and yet, it ends up being like a commercial hit or semi-hit. Obviously, you know, 02:26:06.640 --> 02:26:36.620 I think this is a pretty big song. It got a lot of... Oh, yeah, this song for sure. But as an album, I don't know how it did commercially. I'm sure it probably eventually went platinum, but I don't know at the time how well it sold for him. Yeah, it's not his bestseller, but it's probably one of his... It was a build, right? Every album he built off of it and security was much bigger and got more radio play with... 02:26:36.660 --> 02:27:06.220 You know, like you said, Shock the Monkey. Monkey and I Have to Touch. Yeah, those two songs. And so, you know, it kept building for him. And then, of course, so exploded. But, you know, at the time, like when this came out, it certainly did better than his second album, for sure. The second album is a partial stinker, a little bit. Yeah, I would agree. It's okay. Yeah, it's not great. So. Did anybody else have a misheard lyrics of your childhood with this song? 02:27:06.660 --> 02:27:36.600 Oh, I get the lyrics wrong all the time when I hear this song. I'm talking about the French part. I didn't even know that was French until today. I, this was one of those things where growing up, I thought she was saying something completely different. And I'm like, Oh, that clearly that's French for games without frontiers. Yeah. Yeah. So isn't that, isn't the title of the song based on a, what am I thinking of that? There was a British TV show. I think. Was it British or French? A show where, 02:27:38.220 --> 02:28:05.900 I had it written down. I took it out of my notes. I read something about that. There was a TV show. Here it is. It's a European game show pitting international contestants against each other in athletic contests while in costume. And the British version, I think, was called It's a Knockout, which is why he put that in there. So this just goes to show you that this weird weirdo game in Europe is just as weird as the song and vice versa. The song is just as weird as the game. 02:28:06.640 --> 02:28:35.540 All right, let's move on to the second song that's pretty straightforward in terms of a rock song. That's a song called Not One of Us. It's even more straightforward, I think, than In Through the Wire. I've read a lot of people think this is a down track. I absolutely love this song, especially the live version of the Peter Gabriel Plays Live album. I think that's actually a better version than this version. Lyrical content, it's pretty straightforward. 02:28:36.640 --> 02:29:05.680 You can figure it out without reading it, but it's, you know, how people isolate themselves in groups to exclude others. And it can apply to really anything. And I think he touches on that in the song. It could be race, religion, cliques, whatever. And it's the precursor to subdivisions from Rush in essence, because it's got that same kind of content. I dig this song drum wise because there's, again, no symbols. So there's a lot of riding on that floor, Tom, in this song, which is cool. 02:29:06.640 --> 02:29:36.320 You know, some people think it's a, I would say a throwaway. I think it's a great track personally, and I love it live. I think it's a great live song, but I think it gets a little lost on the album because there are so many other cool songs and other things going on that this one kind of looks mundane compared to everything else and how weird everything else is. Subject matter is not dark, but it is a little disturbing that, you know, people do form groups to exclude others from their groups. And it's a kind of a strange lyric, you know, when you think about it. 02:29:36.360 --> 02:30:05.080 You may look like us, you may talk like us, but you're not one of us. And so I think we can all identify that from growing up in high school a little bit to some degree, you know, somewhat worse than others. But yeah, I really dig this song. I really like the lyrics. This is one of those songs where lyrics can elevate a song that might otherwise just be normal for you. You know, alienation and not fitting in with the herd. 02:30:05.920 --> 02:30:11.840 I'm always down for a song like that. And John, this makes me think of Sepultura's, 02:30:12.400 --> 02:30:35.260 We Who Are Not As Others. And those are the only words in that song. We Who Are Not As Others. And talk about a grower. Sorry, I'm on the tangent here because I love this song so much. It starts off slow and he's just like, We Who Are Not As Others. And then by the end of the song, 02:30:35.340 --> 02:31:05.260 is this huge crescendo and gang vocals of hundreds of outcasts screaming, we who are not as others. Love that song. Anyway, sorry. Yeah, I definitely felt like this was one of the more rocking songs next to And Through the Wire. There's more Tony Levin stick slides and squibs on this. 02:31:05.340 --> 02:31:32.660 song. And you get another, you know, one of the prevalent themes in a lot of Gabriel songs is water. And he starts this song off with it's only water in a stranger's tear. So, you know, he's always used water as a theme in a lot of his songs. And pretty much every album has something to do with water on it. And, you know, this is just a single lyric. 02:31:32.760 --> 02:32:01.900 But if you know that's one of the themes that he uses, he manages to put that in somewhere on every album. So yeah, definitely like this tune. It's definitely rocking. And I would suggest hearing the live version of the plays live because the closing, you know, when he's just saying, no, you're not one of us. And it's almost chanting like it's just really well done. And the song is slightly different because it doesn't have some of the aesthetics on the album that they can't do live. 02:32:02.780 --> 02:32:32.180 It has a whole different feel because there's more kind of synthy sounds live, which is both great versions. Okay, so we make it to number nine. We're closing in on the big track of the album. But before we get there, we have this very somber kind of meditative song called Lead a Normal Life. And if there's a really depressing song on this album, it's this one without question because it's extremely emotional and sad. 02:32:32.260 --> 02:33:01.840 The lyric is very short. The music is written in such a way, it's like no self-control, where you feel like you're in this person's mind who's suffering from mental illness. And it's almost, you think of yourself in times that you, if you've ever struggled with any, you don't have to be mental illness, but just a struggle working through something. It has that feel. You know, in this lyric of, you know, maybe the let me look out the window today, or, 02:33:02.260 --> 02:33:32.200 And it's just so sparse. But it's such an effective song. And I'll quote Stephen Wilson here from Porcupine Tree. T.R., I don't know if you wrote that show with me, when he made a comment about sometimes the saddest things are the most beautiful things. And this song is that. This song is so sad, but it's absolutely gorgeous. And it really is needed to change the pace of the album. 02:33:32.780 --> 02:34:00.600 from the previous three songs, which were more upbeat, two of the three were more kind of rock songs. He pulls you back hard and he's setting you up for this final song. And I think it's perfectly placed. And I will mention this song again in my closing because this song is reminiscent of another song that he wrote during this period that ended up on So that should have been on this album, but it isn't on this album. So we'll get to that. 02:34:01.660 --> 02:34:28.200 That's interesting because, and I'm sorry, George, but I wanted to comment on that because that's exactly what I thought about on this. It's a pre-echo of we do what we're told. And I really felt like that was, you know, what was going on here in terms of like, if you're going to compare it to another song, it definitely seems like a brother or a sister to that tune. 02:34:28.920 --> 02:34:58.760 I agree with all of that and I like the song. But the only thing I really have to add to this is this one starts off like the alarm clock on my phone. Well, you know, it's so it is kind of. Again, you know, we're dealing with life at an insane asylum, right? Like this is like what what he's getting at. 02:34:58.920 --> 02:35:23.540 And I mean, in some ways, it sounds very sedate, right? Like it's very kind of calm. And you get this feeling of, oh, yeah, it's very nice with the view of the trees. And it's quite, it sounds actually pretty nice, you know. But then, you know, it's like, oh, eating with a spoon, they don't give you knives. It's like, oh, okay, yeah, maybe this isn't so great. 02:35:24.760 --> 02:35:54.360 Yeah, I almost got the feeling that during that lyrical part, the person comes with their senses. You know, and that's that moment of clarity that they have. Like, oh, wow, it is nice outside. I'm eating. And then when it goes back to that George alarm clock sound, which is this rhythmic synthy pulse, it's almost like the person slipping back into their illness. Awakenings. Yeah, that's a great example. So. Yeah, I forgot to mention, I thought the lyrics briefly, 02:35:54.520 --> 02:36:24.340 They are just, you know, wow. Yeah. And they're short and it's just like, oh, damn it. So I need a pick me up. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Not this time, buddy. Yeah. It doesn't quite deliver like that. And Peter Gabriel, good fashion. He's going to hit us with a sledgehammer of a song. And to me, this is probably his biggest song, not his biggest hit. 02:36:24.500 --> 02:36:53.100 This is probably his biggest song. It's certainly his most important song ever. And it's certainly his most influential song ever. And that is the song Biko, which was an anti-apartheid protest song about Stephen Biko, who was an activist in South Africa, who was jailed, tortured, and beaten. I'm using his words how he says it live when he prepares the song, and who died. 02:36:53.100 --> 02:37:21.700 And it is the story. Murdered. Yeah. We can. What? Catching my thought there. Yes, murdered. By the police. But it became a really influential song and it helped shed light and awareness on apartheid and what was going on in South Africa. So much so that they ended up having tours to protest South Africa and their policies. And the apartheid tour, which became huge. 02:37:22.720 --> 02:37:52.680 He pretty much was at the forefront of this. And this was in 1980. And those apartheid tours, I think, did start to the mid-80s when they started doing that. And the song was banned in South Africa. Of course. It's no different than North Korea or Russia or anything when something like that happens with music. So just real quick, it starts out with a very kind of sparse. It's not actually an African beat. I think it's actually, 02:37:52.720 --> 02:38:20.040 It's an African beat using Brazil percussion instruments. And there's distorted guitar and it's a slow build. There's a synthesized bagpipe sound in the song. And he's telling the story of Stephen B. Go's death. And it builds up. And the drums and the rhythm are what set the song apart. It's a long song. And it builds up to the point of him chanting his name at the end of the song. 02:38:20.720 --> 02:38:49.260 But the beauty of the song is, if you ever see it live, and it's usually the last song played, it shows, and it always seems to be when he does play it. It is this time. Yeah, and it has been for a very long time. And this really wouldn't be ruining anything, because it's not like you can't go out and see this in video. But the way they structure the song is that band members, when he finishes singing the final lyric, he walks off stage, he's done for the night, and then each band member leaves the stage to the point where it's just the drums at the end. 02:38:49.820 --> 02:39:19.780 And then the drummer walks off and then it's just the patch coming through of the electronic synthy drums. It's just a beautiful song. It's heart-wrenching. And the audience carries on, right? Yes. That's the whole thing, right? The audience keeps singing. Right. And it's a little, a song that is, I always made me wonder if you two use that as inspiration for the song 40. Now they claim they wrote this song at the last second in the studio and it's based on Psalm 40 from the 02:39:20.801 --> 02:39:49.580 But it's hard to argue or to not see the similarities in the song structures and how they use it in concerts. Exactly. The live versions of that. That's exactly what they do on 40 is they one by one leave the stage. And the crowd's still singing. Yeah, exactly. It's very similar. You know, so it is the hallmark of his career. And it's obviously the hallmark of this album. And if you don't know it, you probably should hear it one time, hear it once. 02:39:49.800 --> 02:39:55.380 on the studio and then definitely go look for it live because they are two completely 02:39:55.530 --> 02:40:03.040 different beasts of a song and they're both effective yeah definitely a very emotional song 02:40:03.520 --> 02:40:09.780 and the eyes of the world are watching now i'm a sucker for songs like these you know martyrs and 02:40:10.721 --> 02:40:15.300 inspiring through tragedy and blah blah blah whatever but yeah it's a great closer to the album 02:40:16.020 --> 02:40:44.520 Yeah, definitely real intense. And, you know, I was reading up on this a little, and, you know, the guys at Atlantic were like, you know, what are the, what are American people going to care about a song of like this? You know, who's going to care? And it ended up, you know, being a lot of people did care, right? And it really started a movement in terms of, 02:40:45.300 --> 02:41:13.700 Like political songs that, you know, made a difference. And, and again, it's one of those things like the rest of this album where, you know, you wouldn't think this would be a hit, but it's, it definitely, you know, is very powerful. And this gets back to some of the intensity of Peter Gabriel, you know, the, some of the songs that he delivers with an intensity and you feel that intensity. 02:41:13.860 --> 02:41:36.620 And John, you're right, when it comes to the live production of this, just seeing how he stands on stage and the motions and the gestures that he does in the live show adds a level of power and intensity to this song that, you know, you don't get just listening to the record. 02:41:36.760 --> 02:42:06.720 You know, when you can see him actually performing the song, you get a whole nother level of intensity from this. And that's true of a lot of his songs when, you know, in the live shows, he delivers a level of intensity that is, you know, I won't say it's not there on the album because there is some intensity there, but like it just takes it to another level when you can see what he's doing and you're physically present and you feel it. 02:42:06.780 --> 02:42:07.780 when you're there. 02:42:08.680 --> 02:42:11.180 And that, I think, is a very powerful thing. 02:42:12.280 --> 02:42:12.740 To be sure. 02:42:13.060 --> 02:42:13.460 Yeah. 02:42:14.159 --> 02:42:19.780 It'll be worth it for you, George, at the show, even if you're not seeing a lot of his songs that you know. 02:42:20.160 --> 02:42:23.640 To end with that song will be worth the wait to get to that song. 02:42:25.160 --> 02:42:25.540 Nice. 02:42:26.500 --> 02:42:29.240 So I'll just finish a couple real quick thoughts. 02:42:29.720 --> 02:42:32.160 You know, this is our longest podcast yet. 02:42:32.980 --> 02:42:35.840 To me, this is Peter Gabriel's crowning achievement in his career. 02:42:36.020 --> 02:43:06.000 I hate to use the word masterpiece because I think people throw it around like awesome which I throw around all the time but it really is to me it is his best album not even close and I know people will say again so but these are different types of hits on this album and I think they they work better this album and I recently put my list together it's in my top 20 all time for all albums all genres across the board however had he included we do it we're 02:43:32.760 --> 02:43:36.000 I would definitely say it's one of 02:43:36.000 --> 02:44:05.960 probably is my favorite one by him album. It's the one that I've been reaching for the most the last few years. So yeah, and I look forward to seeing him next month and maybe I'll report back on next episode. There we go. Yeah. Hell yeah. Hells yes. Yeah. So there you go. We went longer than I thought we would with Peter Gabriel, but it is what it is. Yeah. I think we spent the right amount of time on each of these albums. 02:44:06.000 --> 02:44:35.960 I got an album recommendation real quick. Oh, that's right. I got two actually. I'll do them really quick. I mentioned this one on the Metalheads podcast that we recorded on Saturday. The album is called Echoes of Journeys Past. The band name is Flight. They're Norwegian hard rock, proto-metal, progressive rock band. They've got the whole retro sound going without being retro because it's modern. If you're into this kind of 80s traditional metal sound with some 70s influence, 02:44:36.580 --> 02:45:05.100 Give them a spin. I think the best way to describe them is they got that kind of 70s Bloister Cult sound. Bloister Cult had all those things. They were proto-metal, hard rock, they were a little proggy, but none of the campiness like Bloister Cult. Bloister Cult had some campy stuff going on. If you want to find them, they're on Bandcamp. Just look up the name. Again, the name is Flight, but if you need to find them because Flight's hard to find, it's Dying Victims Productions is the label. Okay. So the other one, real quick, Drag is a Krull. 02:45:06.000 --> 02:45:35.520 Journey to the Black Fortress. This is our good friend Keith D. of Arctic Sleep, Unearthed Elf, and about 452 other bands who's on the Metalheads podcast on Saturday as our guest who's been on several times. Yeah, check out episode 141 of Metalheads podcast to hear him. Yes, we had a great time with Keith discussing this album based on the juggernaut sci-fi fantasy, actually fantasy film, Crow. Actually a piece of garbage. 02:45:36.719 --> 02:46:05.420 It's the whole traditional 80s metal sound without all the cheesy of the 80s, which I thought was really well done. It's epic. It's fantasy metal. It's crawl metal. So the album is much better than the movie. Yes, significantly. So that's it. Recommendations if you want to check out some stuff. I agree. I endorse those recommendations. All right. Well, if there's nothing else, thanks for listening. We'll see you next time. Right. 02:46:06.020 --> 02:46:07.880 Peace. Rock on.